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Super Smash Bros. Brawl Hacking => Attacks and Animations => Topic started by: catgowoof on August 10, 2009, 04:38:31 AM



Title: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: catgowoof on August 10, 2009, 04:38:31 AM
So since all the bots were programmed too the characters original moveset, they should play really crap when you vs them right?  Well that's what I thought as well.

As I was testing one of my textures, I happened too be playing a lvl 3 Snake bot with a custom moveset I made.  Now the one move that showed me that bots had a knowledge of the custom moveset I gave him was his DownB.  I replaced the mine move with a rocket blast (think Fsmash), and it was using it like a human would.  I mean, he used it twice in a row.  With a normal moveset he would of blown himself up (not even lvl 3's are that stupid).  He even did a little combo on me which it finished of with a knee too me off the stage (maybe that one was a lvl 9 :S).  Even then, a lvl 9 wouldn't do that with a normal moveset.

I know CPU's copy your moves after I while, but I haven't played enough with my custom Snake moveset for that too come into effect (I think).

So do you think CPU's have a knowledge of PSA?  Are they adapting too the new way of fighting much quicker than we thought o_o?


Also I've also found out that with the custom movesets, my textures load faster.  Yay!


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Gazoinks on August 10, 2009, 05:51:07 AM
Wow, that's pretty interesting.  I'm inclined to say no, because Phoenix Mario's will stand in place and repeatedly use their VB in an attempt to charge Fludd.  I've never seen anything like that though.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Lampp on August 10, 2009, 06:28:47 AM
No, when i battle pheonix mario and knock him off the stage, he thinks he is using the cape move to guide him back   :notimp: :notimp:


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Jose Gallardo on August 10, 2009, 06:34:16 AM
Level  3 CPUs are more random, as opposed to level 9ers who seem programed to repeat certain algorithms. Hence, the custom movesets may work better with lower leveled CPUs. Unless the custom movesets have some relation to their previous settings, the game will play like crap. So no, Sky-net will not rise again.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: dRage on August 10, 2009, 06:38:12 AM
I'm fairly certain they don't when I was testing Flame Wave, the CPU used it for edgeguards only like if it still was Eruption.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: FinalSoraRiku on August 10, 2009, 07:40:11 AM
Once PMario used his FAir to spike me...  But I had been playing with him for a while.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: SSBBVeteran on August 10, 2009, 08:08:21 AM
But marios fair is already a meteor smash, so that doesn't mean anything.  *facepalm*


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: smw66466 on August 10, 2009, 08:46:03 AM
I don't know if they are to good using the move sets but I know when I use CC Shadow and run at people they dodge it.  btw has anyone saved a replay with a custom moveset and then tooken the moveset off and looked at the replay? you look retarded. it's kind of funny.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Scootaloo on August 10, 2009, 08:57:04 AM
lol same thing happens with the wolrd wrap code. It just messed the replay up so much. IMO cpu's don't understand PSA because they r programmed to follow the algorithims of there original program


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Gazoinks on August 10, 2009, 09:15:33 AM
I don't know if they are to good using the move sets but I know when I use CC Shadow and run at people they dodge it.  btw has anyone saved a replay with a custom moveset and then tooken the moveset off and looked at the replay? you look retarded. it's kind of funny.
Yeah, it becomes an entirely different match.  It's really weird.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Untouch on August 10, 2009, 09:21:04 AM
They don't.

I decided to make 2 lvl 9s attack eachother wise angel yoshi, and they kept spamming fly no where near the opponent.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: ᆘ유 | 유유 on August 10, 2009, 10:18:38 AM
CPU's are just little dwarfs sakurai put into every one's wii so they would play the part of a CPU.

CPU's seem to come after me when I kill them, and the don't go after anyone else.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Segab on August 10, 2009, 10:34:18 AM
If you go in Yoshi's island as Yoshi, against a Snake lvl3 (no PSA movesets), and you don't move, he will suicide 3 times. (maybe more, I was playing with 3 lives)

So I guess it doesn't matter if you have PSA movesets or not, lvl 3 computers are retarded.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: FinalSoraRiku on August 10, 2009, 10:53:18 AM
I gotta try that.

No, it would be weird if they somehow did understand PSA.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Tyeforce on August 10, 2009, 11:02:04 AM
I noticed this with Phantom Mario when it was first released. The CPU was using the custom moves like it was supposed to! o_o


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: CayZ5 on August 10, 2009, 12:22:03 PM
i doubt computers can adapt, as already stated, pheonix mario tries to charge fluud, ect. lvl9s arn't that smart anyway i have seen link pull out a bomb and use it on himself, and have caused characters, especially falcon and ganon, to SD numerous times.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Bonzai on August 10, 2009, 01:10:56 PM
To attack and defend: Somewhat; they appear to recognize offensive collision bubbles
To save themselves: No


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Miacis on August 10, 2009, 02:18:18 PM
To attack and defend: Somewhat; they appear to recognize offensive collision bubbles
To save themselves: No
Yeah ... it's basically that. Sometimes they are able to dodge insane moves, but totally fail at using them themselves.
I got an EchoBlade Sheik that kept using his Dark Wave (Neutral-B) for half of the match, while I was far away.

So the answer to this poll is obviously No for me.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Ice God64 on August 10, 2009, 04:47:39 PM
No, not at all. 2 examples:

1: My Lucario move edit has Foxes feel, the heavy physics, and the fast speed, and especially the high gravity. CPU's as my Lucario always kill themselves.

2:My Lucario has a foward B that does a 3-hit combo. The first hit does not damage, but puts the opponent to sleep, the second hit does a silent 4 damage, and the last part is a powerful ice kick. You can interrupt the comb with your own move after the second hit. The CPU did this every time, but not with their own attack, they just rolled away and gaurded(While I was asleep, might I add).


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: sora899 on August 11, 2009, 07:00:30 PM
yeah CPUs r sometimes stupid because when I play in a Free for All(to test my ability to dodge and combo well against 3 players) and Phoenix Mario is in the other team,every time he gets thrown of the stage,instead of doing up B or double jump,he does the Mach Kicks then Shouryuuken....though he does make me unable to hit him cause of side B so I(as Marth my favorite moveset) just use X-fire(yeah I like the dark side)....


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: SnesS on August 13, 2009, 07:38:11 PM
yeah i think so. when i was fighting this wolf custom named Joe, he utilized all of his extra jumps and when i was really close to him he would do his fsmash which is a really close range instant kill instead of grabbing me and doing a dthrow. i was also fighting this custom lucario named kari and it used dtilt attack which is a long range water attack when i was far away


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Dantarion on August 13, 2009, 09:31:25 PM
The AI will use extra jumps.

The ai for the moves is stored into FitCharacterMotion(Etc).pac as ai_character.pac.
Inside that file is 3 other files which control the AI.

Brawl does NOT parse the PSA-related pacs to figure out how to use moves.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: MaxThunder on August 14, 2009, 04:53:19 PM
... i gave yoshi 9 jumps and made his double jump cancel after 9 frames... but discovered that if double jump backwards you get the normal height... and if you spam jump you can stand, and/or walk forwards or backwards in the air(i call this airwalking... its a new at=)...)

i played a level nine of this yoshi... after falling to his doom once he learned that he had a lot of jumps, his normal aerial jumps is like a short hop... but if he jumped back he could get up... and using the airwalking to suddenly stop in the air to punish my edgeguarding... abd aproach whith airwalking... and using his nair when i was behind him(his nair works like his down smash now...) so... i gues they actually can learn...
...
...wow... long post...


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: leafbarrett on August 29, 2009, 12:32:56 PM
They can't understand it very well, but they can understand it in some cases. Echo Blade Sheik does occasionally try to charge her needles, but she always tries to do it close to me (within range of the attack) and more often, she'll just use it once.
PMario has a bit more trouble though.
It seems like they understand normal moves half-decently if you use the character enough, but the specials are usually out of their grasp.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: LavaLatte [.Fade] on August 29, 2009, 01:58:06 PM
They can't understand it very well, but they can understand it in some cases. Echo Blade Sheik does occasionally try to charge her needles, but she always tries to do it close to me (within range of the attack) and more often, she'll just use it once.
PMario has a bit more trouble though.
It seems like they understand normal moves half-decently if you use the character enough, but the specials are usually out of their grasp.

EB Sheik does have a flaw with her B move. If she's really far away, she'll spam B in an attempt to charge her needles. Since they never charge, she won't stop until you run in. Meh.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Garuda on August 29, 2009, 04:38:59 PM
When the CPU isn't the character, they don't usually do so well.

But I've found that when I use a PSA character against the computer, they detect hitboxes and stuff. For example, some CPU characters attack Ganondorf's utilt from a wide distance (it's the one where he has a super-huge explosion of purple, I don't remember which PSA it is), interrupting clanking with the move. So I think they somehow detect hitboxes and priority ranges.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: LavaLatte [.Fade] on August 29, 2009, 04:49:51 PM
When the CPU isn't the character, they don't usually do so well.

But I've found that when I use a PSA character against the computer, they detect hitboxes and stuff. For example, some CPU characters attack Ganondorf's utilt from a wide distance (it's the one where he has a super-huge explosion of purple, I don't remember which PSA it is), interrupting clanking with the move. So I think they somehow detect hitboxes and priority ranges.

Agreed, hitboxes I'm sure they can sense a mile away. =D


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Aezthin on September 22, 2009, 06:37:14 PM
In the case of extra jumps? I've tested that extensively THEY WILL use them. Annoyingly so too. Just leave the infinite jumps hack on and watch them flip straight back onto the level. I'm not sure about the whole PSA hack thing myself tho. I never allow a comp to play as them for the simple fact that they might JUST do something to make the game crash.


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: alphabayton on September 22, 2009, 06:52:40 PM
no they dont know,
their AI is part of a whole different thing, just changeing their pac file wont do anything to the AI so no they dont understand, it is either luck or an accident that they know how to use a character


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Fenox on September 22, 2009, 06:57:32 PM
hell no cpus dumb as sh**


Title: Re: Do you think CPU's understand PSA?
Post by: Shadic on September 22, 2009, 10:21:43 PM
No.

CPUs don't learn.

CPUs only react based off the original character code, the opponents position, theirs, and any hazards/items/other things.