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Super Smash Bros. Brawl Hacking => Programming => Topic started by: SmashKing64 on May 05, 2014, 06:26:01 PM



Title: Project M Codes
Post by: SmashKing64 on May 05, 2014, 06:26:01 PM
All Project M Codes Released In a TXT File

Edited by Albafika: Lolno.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Dantarion on May 05, 2014, 07:33:00 PM
.....so is this what you guys mean by "we reverse engineered the codes"


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Sammi Husky on May 05, 2014, 07:46:57 PM
 :>.>palm:

I don't understand all of this. Like, i understand that people want to be free and use the codes how they want and thats fine by me, but why do people gotta go and release something that someone specifically said they didn't want released...


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Dantarion on May 05, 2014, 07:50:11 PM
Sammi Husky, just wanted to say that I really respect you for the stuff youve been putting out. Its nice to see someone learning programming to make progress in an area that has been almost UNTOUCHED since I worked on porting SSE stages to versus mode stages ages ago.

Anyways, it makes me sad to think that people do this kinda stuff, but hey, in the end I already have all the internet points ill ever need, and I have the skills and knowledge that went into making all the stuff I have created.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Xenozoa425 on May 05, 2014, 07:55:00 PM
Bill Cosby - Brain damage (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyMSc97UksM#ws)

Pretty much sums up this whole ordeal, just skip to 1:44.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Ricky (Br3) on May 05, 2014, 07:55:06 PM
Nevermind this post, I effed up


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: jrush64 on May 05, 2014, 08:03:22 PM
I definitely see where Dantarion is coming from...


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Ricky (Br3) on May 05, 2014, 08:06:10 PM
Is this even accurate? From November to now, I'd expect a lot of those codes to be changed.

Anyway, you know, most of these codes I had never seen. It saddens me that so much useful data is simply hidden for absolutely no reason.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Lillith on May 05, 2014, 08:11:10 PM
Waitwaitwait
Reverse engineered?
'Project M - Closed Alpha, Clone Engine Codeset 11/26/13'
uh


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Ricky (Br3) on May 05, 2014, 08:12:25 PM
Waitwaitwait
Reverse engineered?
'Project M - Closed Alpha, Clone Engine Codeset 11/26/13'
uh

More like major leak.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Dantarion on May 05, 2014, 08:12:33 PM
Just to give you an example of why I get fustrated, lets look at the OP of this thread.

I look in his sig and see "Oh, hes a developer of some Project M based mod, let me check it out, I wonder if hes actually figured out some of the stuff we put together!"

The list of features reads like this:

PMBR's Project M + Phantom Wings BrawlEx
Someones Waluigi, Ridley, Shadow, and Lucina (idk, theres no credits given for these)

He has these awesome bullet points as well.

"All Glitches Fixed"
"Gameplay Fixed"

----------------------------------------

Now lets say I want to give this guy the benefit of the doubt anyways, maybe he put in a lot of time and work into making this possible.

April 20th - He messes up his My Music and posts about it
http://forums.kc-mm.com/index.php?topic=67563.msg1250657#msg1250657 (http://forums.kc-mm.com/index.php?topic=67563.msg1250657#msg1250657)

April 11th - "I want to know how to give certain characters melee air dodges"
http://forums.kc-mm.com/index.php?topic=67412.msg1248353#msg1248353 (http://forums.kc-mm.com/index.php?topic=67412.msg1248353#msg1248353)


Marth 30th - "Project M Unbound"
http://forums.kc-mm.com/index.php?topic=67176.msg1243929#msg1243929 (http://forums.kc-mm.com/index.php?topic=67176.msg1243929#msg1243929)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So basically, this guy is a complete newbie at smash modding, with an account that has only existed since February, and has already repackaged the two BIGGEST accomplishments that have ever been made into a Project that he calls his own, and calls himself a developer.

And then he goes out of the way to post this. That is the part that bothers me.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Segtendo on May 05, 2014, 09:08:29 PM
...and the point of this thread is...?


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Dantarion on May 05, 2014, 09:38:19 PM
Gotta get them internet points bro.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Lillith on May 05, 2014, 10:34:12 PM
Marth 30th - "Project M Unbound"
lol


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Segtendo on May 05, 2014, 10:46:16 PM
Gotta get them internet points bro.
Don't worry Dant. You aren't doing anything wrong here.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Large Leader on May 05, 2014, 10:50:14 PM
lol

I won't blame the guy. I accidentally said Marth instead of Math once.

But yeah... this thread is pretty damn tragic.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Mr. AI | Sluigi123 on May 05, 2014, 11:15:44 PM
SmashKing64, I like the way you did this, though I don't know how long you've been trying to "reverse engineer' the Project M codes, but you did put a lot of effort on this. There was one exception, or a wall as you may call it, and that is to get permission from PMBR to share it to the public. Sadly, you failed miserably. Patience is key, my friend.

I'd mess around codes and hexadecimals, until I find it fitting for it to be shared to the public. It's the code creators' choice(s) whether or not they would share their codes to the public, or have their codes hidden, but have it be in the public's hands, which I find it confusing, cause sooner or later, they will be found. It's like trying to figure out a 6x6 Rubix Cube.

Don't get frustrated about this, PMBR, cause everyone at least knows that the codes will be cracked open sooner or later, before you guys make your final decisions. Hate to say it, but this is life. Life will not be fair, and will always never be.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Miacis on May 06, 2014, 03:55:11 AM
[url]http://forums.kc-mm.com/Gallery/BrawlView.php?Number=203604[/url] ([url]http://forums.kc-mm.com/Gallery/BrawlView.php?Number=203604[/url])
All Project M Codes Released In a TXT File

I am fairly certain that .txt files are not acceptable file formats on the Vault. You should probably keep the MediaFire Link in the OP and expect this BV submission to be deleted soon.

Gotta get them internet points bro.

You still haven't made that thread? People would actually listen to what you say. Instead of hijacking other people's threads to perform your melodrama dance. That's the 5th time already.

Such a shameful thing that unpopular newbies have to be the one to publish these codes. And to think this could have been easily averted.  r)


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Ricky (Br3) on May 06, 2014, 04:54:20 AM
I really wish people of P:M, preferably the code developers themselves, were to explain what some of these codes do. Many of them look very promising.

And I really, really wish that instead of hiding features in order to build hype, the development of codes were made more openly. I'm pretty sure more people would get interested in the coding aspect of Brawl hacking if that was the case. More than that, some people might even be willing to be the beta testers of WIP codes.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Dantarion on May 06, 2014, 10:32:48 AM
SmashKing64, I like the way you did this, though I don't know how long you've been trying to "reverse engineer' the Project M codes, but you did put a lot of effort on this. There was one exception, or a wall as you may call it, and that is to get permission from PMBR to share it to the public. Sadly, you failed miserably. Patience is key, my friend.

I'd mess around codes and hexadecimals, until I find it fitting for it to be shared to the public. It's the code creators' choice(s) whether or not they would share their codes to the public, or have their codes hidden, but have it be in the public's hands, which I find it confusing, cause sooner or later, they will be found. It's like trying to figure out a 6x6 Rubix Cube.

Don't get frustrated about this, PMBR, cause everyone at least knows that the codes will be cracked open sooner or later, before you guys make your final decisions. Hate to say it, but this is life. Life will not be fair, and will always never be.

The only reason that most of the Project M team is still active and making codes is because its a giant community effort to come together and make something. That kind of unity and support doesn't happen in an environment where everyone is randomly doing things.

Hell, I don't even play Brawl or Project M anymore, but I am still active daily. All of the people that have expressed interest in learning assembly coding, an almost requirement for making codes....all work on Project M for the most part.

There aren't even resources on KCMM about programming anything, and the PMBR doesn' thave any, because there aren't any. The development of the codes is still primarily done by the individual coders, but we all sit on IRC there is a wealth of knowledge availible through each other.

If I posted the questions and problems we run into making codes in the PMBR IRC here.....there would be no response. Other than Phantom Wings BrawlEX, what is the latest Ocarina code that has appeared from this community? I'm not trying to hate, I am trying to understand what we supposedly have to gain from opening up our development process?

The things I see going on on KCMM are:

BrawlEX [Phantom Wings]
Work on SSE File Formats [Sammi Husky]
BrawlBox UTF8 Support [libertyernie]
SDHC Support [Bero, made for Project M originally]
BrawlBox2Maya thread [Dantarion]


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Leon Exodio on May 06, 2014, 10:48:39 AM
Sooner or later sttuff like this will happen


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Miacis on May 06, 2014, 10:57:17 AM
I find it extremely amusing that you blame KCMM's "lack of unity and support" for the PMBR siphonning most coders out of this community. If you and your buddies have decided to never release anything and only discuss ASM between each other, just so people would be forced to play your mod to enjoy new things, then it's your own damn fault.

If all our best PSAers disappeared overnight, the PSA forum would go dead really quickly. You're literally one of these PSAers asking: "Why should I come back? Look at this place, how dead it is. I'll stay with my buddies and keep my releases private."
Never mind the fact an open-source community always progresses much faster and gathers more users than keeping things under wraps. Especially for such selfish reasons.

Why do you think Kitty Corp rose so much, back when Stack Smash was still around (and MeowMix didn't even exist)? Not because of our blog, which was pretty bad compared to them at the time. But because we published our [censored] and helped people make even more [censored].
Had we chosen closed-source, we'd have most likely sunk with every other hacking team (and the PMBR would be lacking a lot of talented users who started here).

As for benefits, you also wouldn't have to come and whine every single time someone releases your private project. It'd be a benefit for us all, I tell ya.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Dantarion on May 06, 2014, 11:38:36 AM
Are you blaming the PMBR for the lack of coders here?

Because if it wasn't for Project M, I don't think many of us would be driven to code. Lets take Turbo Mode for example (Which was "reverse engineered" according to SonicBrawler, but in reality, its just taken from this file isn't it?)

Turbo Mode would not exist without Project M. It started off as an IRC joke from a desire to make a April Fools video. It was in theory crafting stages for a while, then I made the 1.0 proof of concept. PMBR tested it, made adjustments, tested it again, etc.

If I had released that 1.0 proof of concept here, %99.9 of the userbase would have just downloaded it, thrown it into a GCT, and then waited for the next version. Instead, we had people that went through every move with every character

What are you asking me to publish? No one is trying to learn from anything that has been done, and it shows in the little amount of progress going on here.

I do remember when KCMM rose, and you guys needed a host. I stepped up to the plate. I remember when I almost got my hosting account taken down because you guys got DDOS'd, then I helped make a backup of the site to transfer it to another host.

Miacis, link me to the amazing advancements that have been made on KCMM in the past year. Link me to the "Open Source" development and sharing taking place here. If you are so proud of your community, and so upset that the PMBR has a bunch of private development going on, show me the amazing things that are possible through the power of KCMM today.

Project M hit 500k downloads for version 3.0....that is something I am proud of. OpenSA is a giant database of almost every detail known about all 3 smash games inner workings. That is something that I am proud of. I helped this site stay afloat a long time ago, and thats something I'm proud of too.

I just wish that you didn't have this attitude where you feel entitled to my work for some reason, or that Open Source means "everything in public", because thats not even close to what it means. BrawlBox is open source, but the amount of people that have worked on it in the past what...5 years can be counted on fingers.

Why is that? Because people want to use things, not make things. That is why Project M is successful, it is a product that people can use and play, not a DIY collection of random codes.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Miacis on May 06, 2014, 11:55:21 AM
I am fairly certain that you don't need to specifically be in a PMBR IRC discussing stuff about a closed-source project to come up with an idea like that. As a matter of fact, there already were individual character codes in SSBM which did very similar things and I doubt they came from anything other than a place where people made random codes for fun.

As for the rest, you obviously have completely unreasonable expectations. This place has been left with much too little activity and releases to expect sudden ASM masters to come out of the shadows and discuss technicalities with you.
At this point, you're just using that as an excuse for your usual absenteism.

And to answer your first question. Yes, I pretty clearly do. That extends to more than just coders, but it's the most obvious case.

(As for the host part, yes, you stepped up to the plate, then widely disappointed when we needed you most, taking days to answer our mails, and never answering to IMs, while KCMM was down for weeks. The rest of the time, we heard from you every... 4 months? There's a reason we went from "free hosting" to paying our own bills.)

You sound like you're very proud and feeling entitled to a lot of things. You expect greatness from others and people to respect your decisions. But I honestly don't see you doing much to warrant all those claims.

tl;dr How 'bout dem topics?


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Kaye Cruiser on May 06, 2014, 11:58:57 AM
I really wish people of P:M, preferably the code developers themselves, were to explain what some of these codes do. Many of them look very promising.

And I really, really wish that instead of hiding features in order to build hype, the development of codes were made more openly. I'm pretty sure more people would get interested in the coding aspect of Brawl hacking if that was the case. More than that, some people might even be willing to be the beta testers of WIP codes.

I just wanted to throw this little tidbit in there but...See, that would work...except not, because it's been done before and it didn't go very well in the end. The reason why they won't do that can be narrowed down into a single name with two syllables.

Brawl+

It was exactly that and because it was, there were too many people doing too many different versions of it and too many people in the B+ Team not seeing eye-to-eye on how things should be and constantly switching things around just as soon as an update was released. That and the head of the thing kinda kept vanishing on and off. In the end, they just terminated the mod and ended up moving on the Project M. There's probably quite a few details I'm missing in there, but I do remember seeing all of that happen and one of the PMBR explaining their reasons to me as such.

I'm sure that if there's anything the PMBR wants to avoid, it's PM becoming the next B+. That's probably why they're so secretive and will probably continue to be until PM is completely done, whether we like it or not.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Dantarion on May 06, 2014, 12:45:47 PM
Yeah, the nightly Brawl+ releases were awful for so many reasons. No one could have fun playing the game if the next night that change you liked was suddenly gone.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Velen on May 06, 2014, 01:29:26 PM
It does not however change the fact that public releases would be beneficial for the community as a whole. However, if that's not a viable option, make a topic, which you did Dant. That didn't exactly pan out and I can tell you why:

Most people want to not have to do anything. Yeah, I'm well aware that's not a positive point for KC:MM, but I have a supplementary point to this: The majority of the forum's members are non-participating. They are "Here For Godzilla", all you have to do is replace "Godzilla" with "Hacks" and the unfortunate truth of the matter becomes clear: Most of the forums members are here for mods for their Brawl games and nothing else. Most of them aren't interested in learning to make them, they just want to play then and watch from the sidelines as the rest of us make stuff.

That's not even including the fact we have a lot of members who are are no longer active in the hacking scene and just take a sort of an "elderly citizen" role to everything. Doing nothing in terms of contributing to the Vault, but giving advice and help sparsely.

Another problem is we have too many members that need help with things. There are many, many topics I've seen in the Help section that go unanswered. That lack of assistance can be a deal-breaker for quite a lot with Brawl Hacking. There's unfortunately a lot of necessary hand-holding that needs to be done before anyone these days can stand up on their own, because hacking has become as advanced as it has.

For those of us with a lot of experience in this scene, things are relatively easy, that's not so for the newbies, many of whom have no experience with anything we use and are learning things from the ground up.

Expecting people to be as good as we all are at our respective specialties from the get go is too unrealistic, unfeasible, and far too high-shooting an expectation to place on new members, if we keep setting the bar higher and higher, we'll get less and less rising stars in the community. Expecting them to learn every single thing on their own will just drive people away.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Akeno/Archer on May 06, 2014, 02:16:22 PM
So... There's absolutely no point insulting the KCMM community for this.

However... There is something I don't like with the person who posted the PM gct. I don't like the simple fact that he TOTALLY disrespected the work of the PMBR by releasing these codes for 2 reasons:

1 - You didn't make these codes. That's something the PMBR made (i don't know the specific names of each one, sorry), and even though you like this stuff, you're not supporting them by doing that and you just show how shameful you are.

2 - More shame ahead: You didn't even FIND these codes in the PM gct YOURSELF.
You asked them to someone who wanted to know about what PM was doing and were interested by this coding. So, you're bringing shame upon an entire community, makes another one fussing even more, and brings more shame to yourself.

If you wanted these codes, fine! Keep them for yourself. Call your IRL friends (if you have any, but I don't give a [censored] if you have or not) and have fun with them. But why would you release them AND make a thread about it?! Dammit!

- You wanted internet points?

Granted! I'm sure the people who downloaded it were glad, and surely they were, who can blame them?

- KCMM Lurkers Downloads?

Granted! Not for long, though.

- Having the PMBR notice how much you steal their work?

Granted! And now we have a new thread full of flamming and all kind of [guesswhat].

Congrats, man. You won. There should be an award for you, but I'm hesitating between Damn Uninteresting Noob or Total Noob Leaker.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Ricky (Br3) on May 06, 2014, 02:58:00 PM
5 new replies above mine, oh well. I'll post it anyway.




Sure, a huge chunk of the community just downloads [censored] and plays. That'd be, let's say, around 75% of the community. Let's leave it at that.

But there are people willing to waste their time into making their own things. If we include both the noobs who make minutes-worth-of-effort recolors and the users with carefully crafted hacks all together, that would probably sum up to around 25% of the community.

This data, keep in mind, is build on basically guesses. Guesses based on the number of members registered on KC-MM, members who make more posts, members that never ever posted (probably just wanted an account), etc. The boards staff probably has more accurate data.

This 25% of the community is still a somewhat large group. These are all of the users who have a vault and the users at Smashboards who make hacks and don't have a vault.

All of these have taken a time to learn something they probably had never thought of to modify their game to their tastes. Myself included. Mewtwo2000, SDoom, Nanobuds. Hell, even you too, probably? All of us have begun to learn these to add, to our own games, the things that we wanted and had in mind.

The thing is, not everyone likes or wants the same things. And if everyone were to modify their games with only what they had the most interest in, we'd be a bunch of people with very little modifications to the game, if any. Because nobody has the time to dive deep into every possible aspect of hacking. We go straight to what is in our interests, learn and create.

It is, though, by the efforts of everyone doing this little scratch in the surface of knowlegde and sharing it with the others that we manage to go deeper into the unknown, with more and more discoveries to be appreciated by all.

It is because we are a community that we have achieved anything at all. Ask Kryal if Brawlbox was conceived with only his own sheer intelligence.

"If I had released that 1.0 proof of concept here, %99.9 of the userbase would have just downloaded it, thrown it into a GCT, and then waited for the next version. Instead, we had people that went through every move with every character"

Sure, look at BrawlEx. That's exactly what happened. Like, for real. Phantomwings released an awesome code with some rels, everyone downloaded that and everyone was happy, right?

No!

It was with BrawlEx being public that we managed to find talented users who, in their interest of pushing it further what was possible, developed programs for it, packs for starters to setup upon, tutorials for everyone to understand and modify the game to their tastes, new modules compatible with it...

To my eyes, these users, the users who share their knowledge with anyone regardless of who they are or what they are going to do with it is what makes me PROUD of this community.

What got me into brawl hacking, mainly, was how Mewtwo2000 and many other users were willing to help those who needed help by telling them how to do things the right way, even to someone with so little knowledge such as I was back then.

And no, telling someone "here's all the important raw data we have, go read" ISN'T teaching anybody. The average person doesn't even know what floating points are. I greatly appreciate what you've done with others on OpenSA, but without minimal basis, the very interesting knowledge avaliable there is almost useless.

And before I finish, I'm not even defending SonicBrawler, what he did wasn't correct or ethic even with the most broad interpretations. Go ahead and bind him to a rock, for an eagle to daily feed on his liver. It's your right as a developer. I'll completely approve.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Miacis on May 06, 2014, 03:08:30 PM
And even without the whole teaching aspect, simply releasing [censored] is probably helping more than dumping raw data.

You don't go to a native, dump bricks in front of his hut and expect him to build a brick house. You build that bloody house yourself, show him how [censored]ing great it is to live in bricks, and then eventually he'll go and give a try at building.
Similarly, people got into vertexing when Cloud happenned. People got into PSAing when Phoenix Mario came out. Etc

People who release stuff create the drive for others to improve. People who don't release anything give others a very good reason to not give a [censored] about their craft.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Velen on May 06, 2014, 03:25:52 PM
@Br3 and Mia: That is exactly right. Let me take this even further with what BR3 was talking about:

Look at KJP. It's because of SDo0m among others that he felt driven to become as knowledgeable as he is in PSA, is it not? It's because SDo0m shared his work, and actually talked about how he did things in addition to providing help to others that KJP was able to grow as a PSA Maker, and now that cycle can continue by him doing the same for others.

Sharing knowledge, teaching others our ways so they can stand up and make their own is the epitome of progress and creativity. Cause creativity is a reciprocal process that grows greater by having people build off the ideas of others to create something greater. When you disallow this, you cripple creativity greatly.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Dantarion on May 06, 2014, 03:28:57 PM
If releasing things creates the drive for others to improve, can you point me towards anything that has been created on KCMM or Smashboards in the past 2 years that is not related to data posted by me or other PMBR members in Project M or OpenSA.


I share more than enough of my work, but no one understands most of it anyways, so I don't want to take hours of time writing up tutorials and posting in threads if its just going to thrown back at me anyways.


@Velen
People get better by being inspired, but theres a limit to that. No matter how awesome Sdoom is, KJP had to take time to learn all of the things that he did, and that isn't something most people have, reguardless of support from the community.

This is something that doesn't happen often. For every KJP, there are 1000s of people that just want to download things and play them, and thats fine. Thats absolutely okay. But don't tell me that people would be inspired to learn coding by me releasing all of my work.

I guess I'll post my module editor today. And we will see what people do with it. My guess is that nothing will be done, even though my module editor supports features that PW lacks. In fact, I don't see anyone doing much module editing (Outside of PW+PMBR).

@Velen, I understand that people need help to get started sometimes, but also understand that helping people is a long and hard process with not much to gain other than personal satisfaction.  When I first started Brawl hacking, I was a college student with all the free time in the world, now I work full-time as a professional programmer, and work on both Project M and various projects outside of my job. I'd love to see a giant stream of interest in Brawl hacking again, but I don't see it happening

https://code.google.com/p/meleetools/
https://code.google.com/p/brawldev/
https://code.google.com/p/opensa3/

While I haven't posted every single code I have made in the past 3 years for Project M, I have contributed back all around, and many codes from Project M have willingly made it back out...the original ASM hackers got bored and went on to do other things. A lot of talented artists are will on the site doing things, but the golden age of tool development and code development is over.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: pikazz on May 06, 2014, 03:34:02 PM
I think I will give my 2 cents here aswell!

have been a hard worker about understanding how Module files work since its really lack of intrest! problem was that I was alone with it only Raw data to look into! each time I wanted either help or toss ideas, no one was there in the beginning!

however, PW came later and help me so my intrest in Module grew bigger and bigger!

it was the same when I started hacking from the beginning! I got all the help I needed to get a bigger intrest! Mewtwo200 was actually the one who help me get into hacking!

its the same now for the new users aswell! if they cant get over the first rock, only a few will get over it without help


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Miacis on May 06, 2014, 03:40:06 PM
If releasing things creates the drive for others to improve, can you point me towards anything that has been created on KCMM or Smashboards in the past 2 years that is not related to data posted by me or other PMBR members in Project M or OpenSA.
Which is exactly what I'm saying. New developments were often motivated by what had been released.

Release more, and more people will intervene on the hacking scene. Keep your [censored] closed and P:M locked and all that potential is going to waste.

Quote
I share more than enough of my work
Lol. I can tell from the amount of stuff in that P:M codeset which was already released.

Quote
I don't want to take hours of time writing up tutorials and posting in threads if its just going to thrown back at me anyways.
Other coders seem to be able to help others very easily despite the so-called KCMM incompetence. Maybe the problem isn't the community, but that just you don't want to share those P:M codes?


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Dantarion on May 06, 2014, 03:50:13 PM
You can't blame PMBR for lack of development here....I don't really get why you keep saying that.

I said I don't WANT to take hours of time writing up stuff.
I already took hours of time making the codes.

How many people use BrawlDJ?
No one? Thats right, because almost no one could figure it out.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Sammi Husky on May 06, 2014, 03:52:46 PM
The sad fact about this all is that the majority of the stuff that Dant and PMBR make are using techniques that are highly technical, for example ppc asm coding. very few people are going to even remotely be interested in it. It's not the fault of the community, it's that the hacking scene doesn't contain enough people who meet the prerequisites for learning these advanced techniques. In order to learn ppc asm for example, they would need to know how alot of computer stuff works. Like exactly what asm is, how memory works, how offsets are loaded and accessed by computers, etc etc. These things are incredibly difficult and time consuming to write a tutorial about, if not near impossible to fit in one tutorial.

The only thing that would happen if they released these codes, would be people using them. I don't really (personally) think that anybody is going to look at them, decode them, examine them, to better their skills and learn how to make something of their own, or advance the development by much if any.

Tabuu is a great example of an amazing resource that Dant released that had a ton of potential, and yet nobody was interested in it because it wasn't user friendly. People who wanted to look at how it worked, or use it for inspiration could/can, and yet nothing comes of it..


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Dantarion on May 06, 2014, 04:17:06 PM
Thats a good example of a tool I made that ended up not being used by anyone. Guess thats my own fault but hey, the source code is out there! I think maybe BJ looked at some of it. Not sure about that but at least I got it out there!

Masterhand is a tool i made primarily for PMBR, but I released it. Never heard of anyone doing anything with it though. O well, source code is out there though!

Anyways, I would love to see more interest in people getting their hands dirty and seeing stuff happen. I still intend on helping with some more stuff on here, especially the SSE stuff, as that is completely new ground with tons of unknown data.

I think I will try to post two things when I get home.

1) my GeckoDol tool! It embeds a GCT and a codelist into a Brawl dol! This can be used with Dolphin to run an extracted ISO with codes! Yay for really fast testing of Project M stuff!
2) my ModuleEditor! It takes a module, decompiles it into .raw and .asm files, then recompiles it back into a dol! Yay for being able to add lines to modules!

I don't think more than 10 people will ever use either these things, and it will take me multiple hours to get them ready for use even though they have been done for like...maybe a yearish? I don't remember.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: SonicBrawler on May 06, 2014, 04:22:57 PM
(http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140308224936/creepypasta/images/3/3d/Michael-jackson-eating-popcorn.gif)

this is getting interesting

but yea. not great posting the ENTIRE leak. glad that got removed.

and its nice seeing you say that you think most of the users on kcmm are idiots who wont understand anything. hiding behind your internet points and popularity, are you dant? afraid that people from kcmm can ACTUALLY do stuff?

I recall Vaanrose being a KCMM member, then joining PM. same with Nano. Are they not counted as KCMM members anymore so that they dodge your line of "kcmm people are idiots"?


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Dantarion on May 06, 2014, 04:29:34 PM
I didn't say anyone was an idiot. I just said that not many here are actively developing anything original. As far as art goes, there are a lot of talented textures, and modelers, and animators, but there isn't really a coding community here, its more of an area for coders to release and give support on things, like BlackJax with BrawlBox, PW with BrawlEx, etc.

I am not afraid that people on KCMM can do stuff, I want to see what you can do. SonicBrawler, what can you do? How do you think people end up in the PMBR? From doing stuff, and then applying.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Sammi Husky on May 06, 2014, 04:29:49 PM
I don't think more than 10 people will ever use either these things, and it will take me multiple hours to get them ready for use even though they have been done for like...maybe a yearish? I don't remember.

0.0!

well, i know i'll be checking them out for sure if you do.

and its nice seeing you say that you think most of the users on kcmm are idiots who wont understand anything. hiding behind your internet points and popularity, are you dant? afraid that people from kcmm can ACTUALLY do stuff?

Woah, why get so offensive? I don't recall him actually saying people on here were idiots SB.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: pikazz on May 06, 2014, 04:33:30 PM
Thats a good example of a tool I made that ended up not being used by anyone. Guess thats my own fault but hey, the source code is out there! I think maybe BJ looked at some of it. Not sure about that but at least I got it out there!

Masterhand is a tool i made primarily for PMBR, but I released it. Never heard of anyone doing anything with it though. O well, source code is out there though!

Anyways, I would love to see more interest in people getting their hands dirty and seeing stuff happen. I still intend on helping with some more stuff on here, especially the SSE stuff, as that is completely new ground with tons of unknown data.

I think I will try to post two things when I get home.

1) my GeckoDol tool! It embeds a GCT and a codelist into a Brawl dol! This can be used with Dolphin to run an extracted ISO with codes! Yay for really fast testing of Project M stuff!
2) my ModuleEditor! It takes a module, decompiles it into .raw and .asm files, then recompiles it back into a dol! Yay for being able to add lines to modules!

I don't think more than 10 people will ever use either these things, and it will take me multiple hours to get them ready for use even though they have been done for like...maybe a yearish? I don't remember.
do be fair, we never heard about the masterhand tool due being only released in PMBR and since they are secret, they dont want to share it?

used tabuu alot actually, but never got able to save stuff :c


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Velen on May 06, 2014, 04:34:09 PM
Woah, why get so offensive? I don't recall him actually saying people on here were idiots SB.

Well, lets just say some of Dant's earlier posts before these latest ones were...-kinda nasty and leave it at that. DS22 wasn't helping much either.

Back on topic, this is the first time I've heard of this Masterhand program. What exactly is it?

@Pikazz: Didn't Dant already say he released that program, Pikazz?


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: ghost_user47 on May 06, 2014, 04:35:35 PM


and its nice seeing you say that you think most of the users on kcmm are idiots who wont understand anything. hiding behind your internet points and popularity, are you dant? afraid that people from kcmm can ACTUALLY do stuff?

I recall Vaanrose being a KCMM member, then joining PM. same with Nano. Are they not counted as KCMM members anymore so that they dodge your line of "kcmm people are idiots"?

When did Dant call anyone an idiot?

Stop making [censored] up.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: SonicBrawler on May 06, 2014, 04:37:58 PM
I didn't say anyone was an idiot. I just said that not many here are actively developing anything original. As far as art goes, there are a lot of talented textures, and modelers, and animators, but there isn't really a coding community here, its more of an area for coders to release and give support on things, like BlackJax with BrawlBox, PW with BrawlEx, etc.

idiot wasnt the correct word. i think it was talentless.

I am not afraid that people on KCMM can do stuff, I want to see what you can do. SonicBrawler, what can you do? How do you think people end up in the PMBR? From doing stuff, and then applying.

What can I do? Are you trying to imply that I cant do anything? Because I have an entire Vault that shows stuff I can do/help with.

and with the stuff I did, I then applied. They way you say it seems like those who work and apply will get in.

When did Dant call anyone an idiot?

Stop making [censored] up.

Yes. I made everything up. I always make things up. I can also remember everything exactly as it happened


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: TheDarkMysteryMan on May 06, 2014, 04:40:56 PM
Why don't we all calm down please?
I don't like seeing people gey angry at each other.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Velen on May 06, 2014, 04:42:15 PM
When did Dant call anyone an idiot?

Stop making [censored] up.

He's not, Nano. The previous posts that have SB all fired up have been deleted (I think), that and -not gonna lie- incompetence is often equated with the word idiot by a lot of people.

Still doesn't make him being antagonistic okay by any stretch, him getting in Dant's face isn't going to do anything productive and he should know that.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Sammi Husky on May 06, 2014, 05:11:40 PM
SonicBrawler i don't think Dant was trying to imply anything by asking what you can do. I think you being fired up is causing you to take things the wrong way at the moment. I would really like if this thread could become a productive conversation rather then just a place to call each other out. :(

Also, MasterHand is a Melee moveset viewer similar to PSA without editing capabilities


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: SonicBrawler on May 06, 2014, 05:58:26 PM
I would really like if this thread could become a productive conversation rather then just a place to call each other out. :(

probably wont happen.



Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: TheDarkMysteryMan on May 06, 2014, 06:00:41 PM
probably wont happen.


I really wish it did. I want to talk about the codes already, not becoming a spectator to some argument.  :kdance:


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: SonicBrawler on May 06, 2014, 06:08:12 PM
so my question is
what specifically has to be done to get the Lucario OHC to work since i was told in my thread it wont work by itself


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Ricky (Br3) on May 06, 2014, 06:11:03 PM
Also, MasterHand is a Melee moveset viewer similar to PSA without editing capabilities

As a Brawl modding forum, I can see why that didn't even appear around here.

So...

Well, at least Dantarion said openly he doesn't want to make tutorials for people.

I have tried learning a bit of coding in order to understand what the codes do. I think it was Dantarion himself who linked this?

http://geckocodes.org/index.php?arsenal=1 (http://geckocodes.org/index.php?arsenal=1)

However, I think it'd be a lot easier for someone with at least some previous knowledge of programming. Learning to program from the very beggining, without a teacher, by myself, is, at least, discouraging.

Seeing these codes, though, has sparked a curiosity in me.

Memory Extention for FighterXResource2 [Dantarion]
Salty Runback (Hold L+R+Y to rematch instead of result screen) V2 [ds22, Dantarion]

Looking at codes like these I can't help but wonder... how? How do they work, why do they do what they do? What each of these numbers mean to do what they do?

A written explanation of some of these codes would be so great... but then again, people would begin to modify P:M to fit their tastes, so I guess that is never going to happen.

so my question is
what specifically has to be done to get the Lucario OHC to work since i was told in my thread it wont work by itself

Dude... I don't think Dantarion or anyone who KNOWS the answer to that is going to help you at this point...


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Dantarion on May 06, 2014, 07:20:46 PM
br3compactor, thats definetly the place to get started looking at the codes.

One thing to note is that a TON of the Project M codes are all C2 codes, as injecting into the games assembly and writing ASM is the best way to do things if you can, and is a bit cleaner than doing conditional memory writes, which is how a lot of older codes work.

The memory extention code increases the size of the memory pools used for loading character data. You can use it to bypass the file size limit. However, that code in particular breaks a few modes...I think SSE and Tournament don't work with it on. (I tested in dolphin and it does work in dolphin, but dolphin doesn't have IOS hogging up a chunk of memory)

The Salty Runback code does what it says, just hold..the buttons it says after a match...and it will instarematch instead of going to the result screen. This code is funny because it was made by accident. Oops. Doesn't work on transforming stages, and transforming characters stay transformed.

SonicBrawler, you told me you decoded the GCT. If that wasn't a lie, then how did you know which code was the Lucario OHC one in that thread you made?

I don't know how it works, I'd have to spend time looking at it to figure it out, shanus made that one, M Lucario was designed by him, after all :D


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Sammi Husky on May 06, 2014, 07:37:07 PM

Looking at codes like these I can't help but wonder... how? How do they work, why do they do what they do? What each of these numbers mean to do what they do?



well if your REALLY starting out, watch this http://www.twitch.tv/internetexplorer6/c/1814114 (http://www.twitch.tv/internetexplorer6/c/1814114)

When i was VERY FIRST getting into code creation i watched this, helped me understand ALOT. then the stuff on that page you linked will be alot easier to understand ;)

The C2 codes that Dantarion is talking about is the codetype for asm injections, but before you learn about those you need to brush up on what assembly is, and then start learning ppc asm. If i had any resources to ppc asm stuff i would link ya, but sadly i don't :/

asm is really important in modifying the guts of the game, because just about ANYTHING is possible with enough edits to the asm. The .rel files have an asm section for example which is responsible for about everything the character does and the game does to characters

As an example, here is the actual ASM from part 1/12 of the turbo mode code from SB's thread.

ADDRESS: 807803A0

stw r3,32(r2)
stw r4,36(r2)
lwz r12,44(r3)
lwz r12,4(r12)
lhz r0,8(r12)
cmpwi r0,5
bne- 0xE8
lwz r0,52(r3)
cmpwi r0,58
beq- 0xDC
cmpwi r0,60
beq- 0xD4
lwz r3,204(r3)
lwz r4,112(r3)
lwz r5,32(r4)
lwz r5,28(r5)
lwz r12,0(r5)
andi. r12,r12,1024
cmpwi r12,1024
bne+ 0xB4
lwz r5,36(r4)
lwz r5,28(r5)
lwz r12,4(r5)
rlwinm r4,r12,9,31,31
cmpwi r4,1
beq- 0x9C
lis r4,256
or r12,r12,r4
stw r12,4(r5)
cmpwi r0,51
bne+ 0x14
lis r4,16384
lwz r12,0(r5)
andc r12,r12,r4
stw r12,0(r5)
mflr r12
stw r12,40(r2)
lwz r4,32(r3)
lwz r4,48(r4)
lwz r3,120(r3)
lwz r3,224(r3)
addi r3,r3,80
lis r12,-32636
ori r12,r12,46808
mtctr r12
li r12,9001
bctrl
stw r31,44(r2)
lis r31,-28644
ori r31,r31,17676
lhzu r5,4(r31)
cmpwi r5,32767
beq- 0x24
lhz r4,2(r31)
lwz r3,32(r2)
lwz r3,44(r3)
lis r12,-32648
ori r12,r12,5568
mtctr r12
bctrl
b 0xFFFFFFD8
lwz r31,44(r2)
lwz r12,40(r2)
mtlr r12
lwz r3,32(r2)
lwz r4,36(r2)
li r5,1


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Doq on May 06, 2014, 09:26:49 PM
Now I remember why I quit Brawl Hacking about two years ago.

Melee hacker here. I began looking at Melee stuff long time ago. Why? Because Melee's stuff is harder to interpret, and I like a challenge. Hacking Melee is just in it's early stages. Right now we have parsed no file entirely except for HPS files (translation: background music), and even then we're a little limited. We wouldn't even have all the fighter data parsed, if Dant hadn't come with the Master Hand. Hacking anything is very tedious for one person, so that's why it's a community. Take me for instance. Other than a project codenamed "Melee Minus" (it's gonna be good), I'm looking into HPS and SSM data (music and SFX). While some of it was parsed a bit by GodF, it can help me to figure out the rest. Not to mention I've started coding some time ago (but that's irrelevant).

tl;dr If you think Brawl Hacking is hard, don't touch Melee's disc.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Segtendo on May 06, 2014, 09:34:25 PM
If we can get as far as the clone engine in Brawl, I think we could achieve anything.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: TheDarkMysteryMan on May 06, 2014, 09:39:22 PM
If we can get as far as the clone engine in Brawl, I think we could achieve anything.
I agree. Can melee produce a clone engine?
Most likely not,


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: SwingSet on May 06, 2014, 09:56:21 PM
If we can get as far as the clone engine in Brawl, I think we could achieve anything.
Let's make brawl 1080p. i dont mean in dolphin :>_>:


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Velen on May 06, 2014, 10:03:00 PM
Let's make brawl 1080p. i dont mean in dolphin :>_>:


That would require new hardware, not software, dude. .__. What the Wii can do is tied to it's Graphics card.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Segtendo on May 06, 2014, 10:21:37 PM
You know what I would like to see?
Dolphin played on a virtual machine.
coughDOLPHINcough


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: WarioManX on May 06, 2014, 10:54:37 PM
I hate seeing arguments like this going on...


I agree that the way the P:M codes were revealed wasn't the right way. I'm still glad to have them out in the open, though. It gives me the chance to take some of the codes and use them in Brawl+.


I guess I'll post my module editor today. And we will see what people do with it. My guess is that nothing will be done, even though my module editor supports features that PW lacks. In fact, I don't see anyone doing much module editing (Outside of PW+PMBR).

[url]https://code.google.com/p/meleetools/[/url] ([url]https://code.google.com/p/meleetools/[/url])
[url]https://code.google.com/p/brawldev/[/url] ([url]https://code.google.com/p/brawldev/[/url])
[url]https://code.google.com/p/opensa3/[/url] ([url]https://code.google.com/p/opensa3/[/url])
I think it was Dantarion himself who linked this?

[url]http://geckocodes.org/index.php?arsenal=1[/url] ([url]http://geckocodes.org/index.php?arsenal=1[/url])
well if your REALLY starting out, watch this [url]http://www.twitch.tv/internetexplorer6/c/1814114[/url] ([url]http://www.twitch.tv/internetexplorer6/c/1814114[/url])

Thank you guys for the links. I truly appreciate these, and I hope others do too.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: SonicBrawler on May 07, 2014, 04:22:38 AM
That long tut by IE. I forgot the link. I had tried to watch it awhile ago but didn't have time. Glad it's posted here.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: pikazz on May 07, 2014, 04:38:53 AM
yay, some good tutorials and Gecko lines in hex! that what I have been missing!
I guess I'll post my module editor today. And we will see what people do with it.
yay! I cant wait to use it! this will help alot
I don't see anyone doing much module editing (Outside of PW+PMBR).
... ;-;


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Sammi Husky on May 07, 2014, 10:42:57 AM
My guess is that nothing will be done, even though my module editor supports features that PW lacks.

Well it will undoubtedly be a useful resource for me at least, it'll help me get a better understanding of the modules and possibly help pikazz with alot of stuff too. :P for all i know it could help enough to where pikazz can do stuff with the stage modules for loading up some SSE stuff. Though thats wishful thinking. Still would be great to have floatin around lol


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: KingJigglypuff on May 07, 2014, 12:09:52 PM
;-;
Maybe you could look into porting/adding articles if you want to try to contribute. :P

I think porting/adding Articles would rank with BrawlEx as a breakthrough.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Eternal Yoshi on May 07, 2014, 12:17:53 PM
Yeah article data is still really sparse and limits all of us with what we can do.
I'd love to be able to add actions and subactions to them cleanly while being able to open the PSA file in PSA.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: pikazz on May 07, 2014, 12:19:36 PM
Maybe you could look into porting/adding articles if you want to try to contribute. :P

I think porting/adding Articles would rank with BrawlEx as a breakthrough.
thats why I want Dants Module builder to easy exprement with articles, would be easier with it

and to find out how to add Actions, did figure out how to add Subactions in Modules, but Actions requires more work


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Sammi Husky on May 07, 2014, 01:07:11 PM
I really really hope he does release it :D would make my day


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Large Leader on May 07, 2014, 02:28:31 PM
Maybe you could look into porting/adding articles if you want to try to contribute. :P

I think porting/adding Articles would rank with BrawlEx as a breakthrough.

That would be amazing.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Sammi Husky on May 07, 2014, 05:06:41 PM
Indeed, i would be interested in tinkering around in the files to learn how to port articles as well...

Now...to go find that thread where PhantomWings posted about it and save all the info..


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: KidCraft24 on May 09, 2014, 10:13:10 PM
If article porting is figured out maybe we can figure out how to fix the issue with Brawl EX mewtwo and why he constantly spawns lucarios aura sphere even when all actions pointing to lucarios aura sphere aren't their. also will fix the issue with olimar clones and the antenna lights being linked.


Title: Re: Project M Codes
Post by: Lillith on May 09, 2014, 10:15:28 PM
If article porting is figured out maybe we can figure out how to fix the issue with Brawl EX mewtwo and why he constantly spawns lucarios aura sphere even when all actions pointing to lucarios aura sphere aren't their. also will fix the issue with olimar clones and the antenna lights being linked.

KJP did a Mewtwo that doesn't have that problem~
http://forums.kc-mm.com/Gallery/BrawlView.php?Number=203252 (http://forums.kc-mm.com/Gallery/BrawlView.php?Number=203252)