*Sees Dixie Kong*

I love you man, bringin back childhood memories

Akuma please, and for the love of god put him on C. Falcon

Haven't checked here in a while, has there been an update to Shadow with the new uptilt and downair changes and whatnot?

Also, Dudley and Spiderman.... awesome

Hey guys, I'd like to change the U Tilt to something else.  I've had a lot of complaints and criticisms about that move and looking at the move more it could use some changing.  However, I'm not too sure what to change it to.  I definitely don't want to use Sonic's U Tilt.  Not only would that be lazy, but the AAA combo already involves the U Tilt.  But I'm really stumped on ideas

But apart from that, expect the alternate versions to be released in a few moments.

I was going to say something too but I wanted to get the more important stuff out of the way first

Um, in terms of kicks I think you're out of luck if you want a different animation, so how about an uppercut?



It can function just like the old uptilt being a juggle move, and if you want 2 hits maybe you could make it work like a shoryuken from street fighter:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOlzG2w8UwM&playnext=1&list=PL0B436875ED623F88" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOlzG2w8UwM&playnext=1&list=PL0B436875ED623F88</a>

(@ 0:23)

Alright I've been playing as Shadow for a while, and he seems near perfect, I've only got 4 concerns

1) His Sibe-B Air, it's cool that you can wavedash in Vbrawl BUT it overpowers his recovery, it's just way too easy to get back to the stage throwing out a projectile every second slowly inching your way back to the stage. He's able to live far too long because of this, I'd have his aerial chaos spear aim downwards diagonally like Sheik's needles in the air, that way at least he won't have a hit box almost constantly right in front of him while heading back towards the stage making it near impossible to gimp him, and if possible it would be good if he only moves forwards on his first aerial chaos spear, and if he does it more than once he can't inch forward or back and just goes down, but if you don't get the chaos spears to aim diagonally down, he can just jump off the stage and spam them back at the stage for a good while

2) Down-Air, this move is AWESOME, but there's something wrong with it, you have it so that if you miss with the move, he has small landing lag, but if you DO hit with it, you can't do anything right after you bounce back up for a while and he has a crapload of landing lag 0_o, the point should be that if you land the move you get rewarded, not punished, because as it is, it's just not a good move to use because if you do land it, your opponent can tech and have AMPLE time to retaliate, I'm talking almost enough time to pull off a Falcon Punch here, so if you do hit your opponent with this move, be prepared for huge backlash, and off the edge, your at a good risk of killing yourself if your aim is not 100% accurate, I would reverse the effect and make it so if you do land the move, when you bounce back up you can immediately act and do anything similar to how Project M's Zero Suit Samus' D-air works(actually that's really what it does) but if you miss the attack THEN you get huge landing lag, and if your worried about being able to act immediately overpowering his recovery, well first off your current air side B does that job much better, and second is that the fact that it bounces you up already helps with recovery a bit anyways

3) Chaos Control, I know the animation is longer but good lord man make it so you can stop him from doing the move by hitting him, having him be invincible while performing it is too cheap, especially if he has it ready, kills an opponent, and then uses it when they spawn again and bam, you can get a free 30-45% easy right away

4) Weapon spawn, at least you can stop this one, but I don't know if you realize how powerful Brawl's items are, spawning the ray gun, cracker launcher or superscope pretty much guarantees a kill, and 10% isn't enough to compensate for that, I would up the damage a little and make the animation slightly longer, or you could make a version without CC and weapon spawn like the last version

Trying out the new moveset, you changed the AAA combo back YES!!

Also, I found a cool AT, because of the initial momentum of the first hit of the B-air, if you do it RIGHT before you hit the ground, you slide back a good distance if you time it right, it's not choreographed too bad and you can turn and grab, it's pretty sweet but also pretty hard to pull off good

Also, don't short hop D-air, your opponent can tech and attack back before your landing lag ends

Is it possible to vertex items? If so I'd probably be willing to make the cracker launcher look more like a rocket launcher, etc.

Here's what I've done sofar as well as plan on doing:

- Increased speed, reach and knockback of F Smash (all have only been slightlytweaked so it's a more well rounded killing move
- Replaced U Smash animation (it's a smoother one) as well as general damage and knockback tweaks
- D Smash has a bit more reach
- N Air last hitbox has a bit more knockback + N Air landing laghas a hitbox that lasts for 3 frames upon landing and pushes foes away.
- D Air is completely different.  He spins then does a downward kick that spikes the foes down at an angle.  Because if the initial spin forward, it takes a bit to get used to the trajuctory.  If the attack hits Shadow bounces off the foe.
- Neutral B on the ground has more startup and endlag.  
- Fixed the Side B Air
- Fixed the Chaos Control
- Fixed Chaos Blast

There are probably more that I'm forgetting, but that's the majority of them.

This sounds excellent, only a few concerns:

-one is the neutral ground B, if it still functions the same attack wise, then nothing changed much about it as an edgeguard tool, I'm telling you it's an auto-kill move for opponents off the stage because not only does it reverse them, it also pushes them in the reversed direction, if anything I'd have it function like Mario's cape, that way although the direction is reversed, it won't push them far away, also the capes reflection property seems more professional than whatever random thing you have going on with it now, on top of that with more startup and endlag it's even more useless on the ground when not near the edge, any opponent can take the first hit and attack right through his neutral B while it's still out

-This is more of a question, does his F-air have any knockback growth?

-And about his B-air, would you consider making the first have weaker knockback to combo to the second similar to Link's B-air? FFing the first hit to a reverse grab would be sick

-And are you going to change the AAA combo to how it was? It wasn't overpowered before, it just allowed more comboing options but you had to time it really well, but now it doesn't matter how good you time it, the combo options aren't possible anymore

So I guess Mario's cape is overpowered too then, huh? ¦D

N-B is fine. Leave it as it is. Aerial should only be allowed one use though. No freefall afterwards, just only able to use it once. Otherwise you can just stall in midair for a while and there's nothing anyone can do about it.

No it's not because it doesn't change direction AND add velocity to the reversed direction

@Sanitys_Theif

I forgot to mention that I don't know what you're talking about when you said it reverses the foe.  It does have cape properties at all.  It just sucks them in then pushes them back out again.

!? For me it sometimes turns my opponent around AND pushes them away, either way, having an attack that can stay out that long with a big hitbox that forces people away is an OPed edgeguard tool to me

I didn't remove Chaos Control...though I made a mistake with it so it was really really hard to use.  I've fixed that now.

And from my experience the N Air is anything but useless.  Infact in this release it was his best aerial due to its huge range and the fact that it covers his entire body.  Not to mention its low end lag.  You're literally the only one who has said that it isn't useful.

And I'm definitely NOT changing the Neutral B to Chaos Blast.  So many other Shadow movesets have done it already and it's already the Final Smash.

I'll increase his kill potential a bit, but I'd rather have this PSA slightly underpowered and fun rather than stupidly oped like before.  I honestly don't want to get carried away with buffing him as much as I did before. Most of Shadow's moves aren't designed for killing in this moveset.

N-Air is more a double edged sword, sure the end lag is low, but it has little to no knockback so your opponent can usually hit you before you're able to do anything, and it doesn't have good priority so it's not like it's impenetrable, I'm only saying this out of experience playing lvl 9 computers and a decent fox player

About the Neutral B, that's fine, it's just you should adjust what it is now a bit, it's too cheap as an edgeguard tool and it's rather useless on the ground

It becomes more annoying than fun when you actually want to get on with the match and take off a stock from your opponent but it's taking too long because your character is weak as hell, when I use Shadow, matches are lasting around 5 minutes, because although I have more skill than my opponents, my character is not suited to win, so the match ends up being dragged out and it becomes incredibly annoying to keep on fighting, having to resort to only 2 or 3 attacks that can kill and repeating them just to get on with the match and end it, it would be much more fun to have about 80% of his moveset useful and practical to kill so you can change it up and not have it be so boring to play as him

I'd just increase his killing ability to that of Sheik's at least, she doesn't have incredibly overpowered smashes or tilts or anything, you have to know which moves to use at the right time and combo a person out, but she does have at least a reasonable level of power to use which is what this Shadow is lacking

Just trying to help, I like the new moves but most of them aren't practical to use to keep on progressing with the match

BTW I know the last moveset was OPed, but not on a ridiculous level, he was more like a top tier melee level whereas I would aim for high tier, this new moveset is worse than bottom tier, you went to the exact opposite side of the spectrum, I think it would be best to find a good medium

[Overview: Tilts = good]

New Shadow Moveset? Cool, I like the new moves, but here's the review

Basically, he's like the first Roy moveset ever made and the Zero moveset for Link, in short, he's fun to play, but he's got a terrible metagame and winning with him just isn't fun


AAA Combo: I don't know what you did here but you changed the timing, the animation looks the same, but I used to be able to do AA, crouch cancel, and side-tilt/up-tilt/grab/pretty much anything but now all you can do it start the attack over, whatever you did, I'd change it back

Up-tilt: The animation is a little clunky, and the range is kind of poop, I would just use Sonic's up-tilt animation and maybe add fire

Overview: Tilts = good

Sidesmash: This move is pretty useless now, I know it was overpowered in the last moveset(I didn't say anything since you said you were done with Shadow at the time) but the start-up time makes it unsafe and it's reward in damage isn't great, so I don't use it, you should speed it up and have the damage and knockback be similar to Sheik's side-smash, otherwise it's a pointless move as it's too easily choreographed, I understand about making it weaker which is fine, but making it slower too just makes it absolute poop

Upsmash: You can't kill with this move, not a problem, it's fine, the real problem is he has no reliable killing smash attack, His down-smash is just a better version of his sidesmash, they both have the same function, slow start-up time and powerful but Sidesmash is weaker thus making it useless, catching an opponent with a downsmash is very situational and doesn't happen often if at all, and Upsmash doesn't kill, so for ground game, he's pretty bad, I would make sidesmash come out faster and have it around Sheik's sidesmash in strength so he can have at least 1 somewhat reliable killing smash attack

Overview: Smashes = poor

N-Air: This move is completely unsafe except for 1 situation, it's unsafe because as soon as you land, your opponent can retaliate with a quick attack making it more or less a suicide, it's only good situation is if you can get the attack to finish in the air, but even then your opponent can DI easy, land and attack when you land so it's really just not good to use, maybe as an edgeguard sometimes but it's priority isn't high

F-Air: Love this move, it's cool, but it has no knockback growth, you can't kill with it, not that you have to but continue reading as to why it's a problem

Backair: His only killing aerial attack, but only on the second hit, and seeing as an opponent can DI easy out of the first one, it's unreliable

Overview: Air Game = terrible
None of his aerial attacks can kill even slightly reliably, up-air is a juggle move, but not a good one as it sends opponents too high, F-Air does not kill until around 250% or so, Down-air suffers a similar problem as the N-air with landing before it finishes, N-air is completely unsafe, Basically with Shadow, his only reliable method of killing an opponent is to down throw run and back-air and hope to God that your opponent forgets to DI

Neutral B: Grounded, an opponent can take one hit, not move, and throw an attack at you before another hit comes out, in the air it's ok as a defense for someone doing a jump attack, honestly I'd just change this to chaos blast and have it function like Ike's neutral B with the smart bomb explosion graphic, at least then he'd have an edgeuard tool, N-B grounded does edgeuard cheaply in the fact that it reverses direction AND pushes the opponent away, if Shadow had an overpowered move, it would be this

Side B: Awesome, but in the air, could you have it angle downward? And the pause make's it an annoying slow way to recover

DownB: Awesome, but no real killing power, Down B in the air is pretty slow

UpB: His recovery is somehow a bit worse, could you make this so you can choose a direction to help somewhat

Overall you can't kill with Shadow, every time I face an opponent, I can't kill them until they get to the 200%-250% range unless I luckily manage to pull off a downsmash but lvl 9 computers and my friends aren't dumb enough to fall into that too often, and his combo game has gone down a bit

Also you took out his chaos control but left his item spawn ?

I love the win animations and taunts btw, he needs some improvement, I understand about nerfing him from the last moveset, but you took it a bit too far

Hum, I use Riivolution, what do I need to add to my XML to make this work?

No

Sorry lol I'm just so hyped to have completely removed Olimar which is [censored] to me and now having Cloud and Ike back. I'm ready to replace Ice Climbers, GW, Jigglypuff, and ROB.

Same here

*Still waits for Marth, Link, and Metaknight ports*

lol dude slow down. The clone engine is in alpha state, and the holy ft_ike.rel was a gift from our friend PhantomWIngs. Link and metaknight might have not even been touched yet!

That and did PW ever say he was gonna work on another character? And from what I've seen, his method for his work hasn't been revealed

BUMP

Heaven section added, but in a new style, this is easier and faster for me but lemme know if you'd rather have it the old style

I'll update this more often since it's getting a little more attention

Your Epic section of music is......well, Epic. Totally downloaded that and the Menu OST.

I like how you've divided the songs into Thematic sections as opposed to Song Source sections. When I get into hacking and make my own music thread, I might follow suit.

......that is of course if it's okay with you?? " Imitation is the highest form of flattery??

Thanks, and yea go ahead do what you want, if you get enough songs you could just merge your stuff into this thread if you want

Use the ID's here.

http://anonym.to/?http://opensa.dantarion.com/wiki/IC-Constants

I used the numbers you provided in your edited post, but Cloud still can't jab over G&W, does it not work or did I do something wrong?


EDIT:

Here's the code I made for it

Code:

XX has YY's IC-Constant: Ike over G&W [Dantarion]
C2858928 00000003
2C040012 40820008
38800022 1C040038
60000000 00000000