Dantarion's done it again!

[SiLeNtDo0m]

Yeah...thanks for the completely pointless and off topic argument everyone. 

Seriously people, what the hell is the point.  All you're doing is trying to hammer each others opinions into each others heads and you're all failing miserably.  Is it so hard to accept each other's different views? 

[Psycho Philia]

SilentDoom: I will answer you, it seems indeed that hard, or this discussion wouldn't have happened... Honestly, you're totally free to have your opinion about the question, personally I don't agree with LC-DDM opinion, but I respect it, he thinks what he wants about something, and besides, how can you compare two things COMPLETELY different? The costume added, and the clone engine are two completely different things, how can you say that one thing is better than the other? I use the term better because it was the one used by someone.

Honestly, if you're not able to respect the opinions of other people, you shouldn't post. As simple as that.

And an other thing, do you think Dantarion would be happy to see what happens on this topic? To see that his work leads to a fight of opinions because you're not able to accept other opinions than yours? It wouldn't be surprising to know that dantarion hates this topic, and if it is the case, it would have been really fast to make him think this...

[RandomTBush]

Awesome, I've always been wanting some more character costume slots! For some of the characters, there doesn't really seem to be enough (like Pikachu, for instance), and some have lots of alternate costumes I like that I've had to leave out because of not having the room for 'em.

[Rayn]

And an other thing, do you think Dantarion would be happy to see what happens on this topic? To see that his work leads to a fight of opinions because you're not able to accept other opinions than yours?

Quoted for truth.
500 post get!! [/noob-posting]

[Albafika]

NTSC-U hackers are hacking the game for their own use, and we all should be glad they're sharing their work with the community, now, do you really think any NTSC-U hacker give a damn about PAL or NTSC-J? It's not a matter of making it easier for PAL users or NTSC-J users that want to save their save, it won't get them any credit or any fame, everyone'd just download and use, they're already doing too much for NTSC-U and all they get is a "Thanks!", do you really think they;d go as far as to port 'em for the regions they don't play to just receive a "Thanks!"? I'm not even sure how can they share their work with us.

Also, if you're into Brawl Hacking, having your Wii use NTSC-U won't be too dificult, some codes over here are way more complex than the step by step guide to make your Wii be regionfree.

ON-Topic: If someone does looks into that of replacing the common5.pac on the ISO with higher size and still working... I, myself, will test this ISO thing. I just can't believe it.

[LC-DDM]

So what you're saying is that the PAL using people should belong in the crapper just because they don't have the OH SO GODLY gift of being in the same region as you? I'm pretty sure epic hackers don't do it for the "credit" or the "fame", but rather to expand the game boundaries themselves. Also, on "everyone'd just download and use"... hmm, I'm pretty sure the US people who use the codes also do that. Unless you use it without downloading it in which case you must be a magical wizard of sorts. Wait, wait, I get it, you're saying they can recieve a "Thanks" from the US people but not from the PAL people who would obviously do the same as the US people (say thanks, download, and play it)? Am I missing something here? Are the PAL users suddenly from another world?

You're assuming, AGAIN, that some people know how to hack the Wii enough to have it Wiigion free (might wanna shoot me for that word now...). You're forgetting the teens that just got into it, the ones that all they know how to do is boot up the HBC and use Gecko to run downloaded codesets. What about those? Should they be shunned too, PAL or US? I mean, you're still keeping the PAL barrier (using the US version on an European Wii doesn't fix the problem of not having ported codes, y'know).

Yes, I know Dantarion has worked his ass off to get this working, and maybe getting it to work in PAL (either by him or anyone else porting the codes) is too much of a hassle, but if we're going by that logic, him getting this to work in US was a hassle in and of itself. So why not throw the PAL users a bone for a change? Look at what B+ and P:M did, they made it so PAL users didn't get the short end of the stick. You have to have respect for that, because they did what other people wish they could do: Bring the community together without regional differences.

[_Data_Drain_]

While I may not agree with all of LC's points, I do think it's annoying that PAL players are considered minor priority, and it's not just Brawl.

Every game almost takes SO MUCH LONGER to come out there, then here, or Japan, maybe these hackers could get a PAL IOS, and see how it's different, then maybe make some changes to their programming... Although, I guess this would be very hard...

Still, I feel PAL players are toss aside too much... Heck, I'm not a PAL player, and I still think this, it is rather wrong also to toss that statement aside, it's just that simple, basically, hacking is saying, "GO HOME AND BE AMERICAN! **** YOU PAL PLAYERS!"

...Okay, maybe not that, but still, I wish some PAL hacker who knew all this stuff could help out.

[Albafika]

So what you're saying is that the PAL using people should belong in the crapper just because they don't have the OH SO GODLY gift of being in the same region as you? I'm pretty sure epic hackers don't do it for the "credit" or the "fame", but rather to expand the game boundaries themselves. Also, on "everyone'd just download and use"... hmm, I'm pretty sure the US people who use the codes also do that. Unless you use it without downloading it in which case you must be a magical wizard of sorts. Wait, wait, I get it, you're saying they can recieve a "Thanks" from the US people but not from the PAL people who would obviously do the same as the US people (say thanks, download, and play it)? Am I missing something here? Are the PAL users suddenly from another world? You're assuming, AGAIN, that some people know how to hack the Wii enough to have it Wiigion free (might wanna shoot me for that word now...). You're forgetting the teens that just got into it, the ones that all they know how to do is boot up the HBC and use Gecko to run downloaded codesets. What about those? Should they be shunned too, PAL or US? I mean, you're still keeping the PAL barrier (using the US version on an European Wii doesn't fix the problem of not having ported codes, y'know).

Yes, I know Dantarion has worked his ass off to get this working, and maybe getting it to work in PAL (either by him or anyone else porting the codes) is too much of a hassle, but if we're going by that logic, him getting this to work in US was a hassle in and of itself. So why not throw the PAL users a bone for a change? Look at what B+ and P:M did, they made it so PAL users didn't get the short end of the stick. You have to have respect for that, because they did what other people wish they could do: Bring the community together without regional differences.

I never said that, I just said that it remains a fact that the NTSC-U hackers are hacking for themselves and none of 'em don't really care about the other regions. I'd be neat to have it on PAL (I myself have a PAL version of Brawl, I just love the spanish accent they got. XD) but we're facing a reality here, the only ones that'd port codes to PAL are the PAL user hackers, and those aren't as Godlike as the NTSC-U. I'm not saying it's right, I'm just saying it's what it is, and you complaining like this about it won't change anything, I mean, you don't have nothing to encourage them to do it other than whining, and of course, not only you, none of us do, they're doing these hacks 'cause they feel like it, not 'cause they have to, and having them work on other versions as well, what for? They only care for their version.

You can mix my words and take them however you want, my point stays clear and true. -__-

And you DO love to argue, wow! If youre need for arguments made you blind, I'll happily clarify:

everyone'd just download and use, they're already doing too much for NTSC-U and all they get is a "Thanks!", do you really think they;d go as far as to port 'em for the regions they don't play to just receive a "Thanks!"? I'm not even sure how can they share their work with us.

I there said "everyone'd just download and use, they're already doing too much for NTSC-U and all they get is a "Thanks!", do you really think they;d go as far as to port 'em for the regions they don't play to just receive a "Thanks!"? " which explains itself, we (NTSC-U users) just give 'em a "Thanks!" and use their stuff, would PAL do any diferent? Is them porting it worth it for a "Thanks!" They're already sharing work with NTSC-U that we don't deserve.

Project: M and Brawl+ are projects that even have some PAL users in their developers team, and even if not, they wanted their game  to be played Wolrdwide. As much as Dantarion would love to port to the other regions, he wouln't, he's really tired of the NTSC-U community, and the PAL community won't be better, I mean, just look at how you're whining about the codes not beeing ported, how do you think he'd feel if he read this?

Concerning the Region Free hacking, if you're into Stage Roster Expansion, Alternate Stage Loader, these two are way more complex than hacking the Wii to be regionfree which is a step by step guide. Also, conerning the save and completition data? At least I don't care about it, and I'm sure you're of the minority that does care. I've gotten into completing it a bit, but that's when I have like nothing else to do with my life
What you're asking is for full development on Brawl, isn't that a BIT too much? And even being too much, you're whining and arguing about how this SHOULD BE made! Are you reading yourself? Seriously? Just go and help the rest of PAL porters if you want it this bad instead of whining everytime this is commented about.

I'm sorry for the OFF-Topic, ds22.

[♤♡◇♧]

People, get back on topic now.
This thread is about adding character costumes, not about the whole PAL coding issue.
Please refrain from discussing this in this thread.

[Albafika]

I'd love to try this out, i'll add a common5 that freezes for me (libertyernie's common5 for Classic Expansion Stage) with the addition of 256 colors CSPs of Cloud over Olimar (Comparing their file size, Cloud's were above 20 KBs while Olimar's are of 10 KB each) and see if it doesn't freeze...

[Jaklub]

New costumes slots, even if not as awesome as the clone engine, are still great.

I'm looking forward the release.

[LC-DDM]

But wait, if they ported the PAL codes, wouldn't they be just as godlike? Maybe not in US eyes, but in PAL eyes they would be deserving of a medal for achieving in PAL what was already done in US. Maybe a shoddy reason for credit, yes, but a reason is a reason nonetheless. I don't have nothing to encourage the porting because there's really no point in trying to encourage someone that, as you said, only focuses on the US side of things. With that, I'd rather encourage the PAL side of things instead. Sure it may fall on deaf ears, but at least I'm bloody trying the best I can to attempt something of the sort. Hell, I've tried and failed brilliantly at learning how to port myself, so it's well known that it's no walk in the park, which is why it should be left to the more well known and more intelligent people like Dant or an European porter. Hell, maybe if Dant had both version we would see those at the same time?

Though I don't think PAL would do different than saying an European "thanks/merci/danke/gracias/grazie", porting it for a "Thanks" is about as worth it as making it in the first place for a "Thanks". >_>;

P:M and B+ are just two great examples of small communities who want the hacks to be played Worldwide. I put it to you, why couldn't other hackers set aside the differences? Yes, maybe the PAL community wouldn't be better, but then again, other than the regular codes (character modifiers and stuff), we don't really have that big of a list on codes compared to the US, which has better response to it simply 'cause most of the community is located in the USA. And even if I "whine" as you say, I'm sure I'm not the only one that complains sometimes, and I'm sure it's not the PAL faction that "whines" sometimes, either. Remember how the Clone Engine is still being urged by people who're "whining" to be finished?

Again, as complex as they are, don't forget we still have many users who just got into the whole hacking business. Don't expect them to know how to hack the Wii regionfree firsthand, nor apply the codes to their own personal GCT files. Baby steps are the key. Maybe you don't care about the save data, but when you're putting over two to three years of work to get the 100% (not whole days of nothing but playing, just the afternoons and weekends), and then you're told to screw all that effort in order to get the hacks you mentioned above just to expand the life time... wouldn't you be iffed yourself to have it all go down the drain just for an epic hack? I'm not asking for full, complete development. What I'm asking is just for this set hack to be ported. The other epic hacks can take their own time to be ported. I'm sure I'm not the only one who'd like this along with other epic hacks (though I prioritize as this over the others), but PAL always gets shoved aside in everything. So, maybe once, just once, there should be a small light in the darkness of PAL hacking.

Of course this will all be moot when someone develops a program to convert hacks from NTSC to PAL and vice versa.

Wall of text aside, I can't wait for this to be released.  *cough* >_>

 Going off topic again after being warned not to.

[Albafika]

But wait, if they ported the PAL codes, wouldn't they be just as godlike? Maybe not in US eyes, but in PAL eyes they would be deserving of a medal for achieving in PAL what was already done in US. Maybe a shoddy reason for credit, yes, but a reason is a reason nonetheless. I don't have nothing to encourage the porting because there's really no point in trying to encourage someone that, as you said, only focuses on the US side of things. With that, I'd rather encourage the PAL side of things instead. Sure it may fall on deaf ears, but at least I'm bloody trying the best I can to attempt something of the sort. Hell, I've tried and failed brilliantly at learning how to port myself, so it's well known that it's no walk in the park, which is why it should be left to the more well known and more intelligent people like Dant or an European porter. Hell, maybe if Dant had both version we would see those at the same time?

Though I don't think PAL would do different than saying an European "thanks/merci/danke/gracias/grazie", porting it for a "Thanks" is about as worth it as making it in the first place for a "Thanks". >_>;

P:M and B+ are just two great examples of small communities who want the hacks to be played Worldwide. I put it to you, why couldn't other hackers set aside the differences? Yes, maybe the PAL community wouldn't be better, but then again, other than the regular codes (character modifiers and stuff), we don't really have that big of a list on codes compared to the US, which has better response to it simply 'cause most of the community is located in the USA. And even if I "whine" as you say, I'm sure I'm not the only one that complains sometimes, and I'm sure it's not the PAL faction that "whines" sometimes, either. Remember how the Clone Engine is still being urged by people who're "whining" to be finished?

Again, as complex as they are, don't forget we still have many users who just got into the whole hacking business. Don't expect them to know how to hack the Wii regionfree firsthand, nor apply the codes to their own personal GCT files. Baby steps are the key. Maybe you don't care about the save data, but when you're putting over two to three years of work to get the 100% (not whole days of nothing but playing, just the afternoons and weekends), and then you're told to screw all that effort in order to get the hacks you mentioned above just to expand the life time... wouldn't you be iffed yourself to have it all go down the drain just for an epic hack? I'm not asking for full, complete development. What I'm asking is just for this set hack to be ported. The other epic hacks can take their own time to be ported. I'm sure I'm not the only one who'd like this along with other epic hacks (though I prioritize as this over the others), but PAL always gets shoved aside in everything. So, maybe once, just once, there should be a small light in the darkness of PAL hacking.

Of course this will all be moot when someone develops a program to convert hacks from NTSC to PAL and vice versa.

Wall of text aside, I can't wait for this to be released.  *cough* >_>

It'd be nice if they could port it, 'cause as I said, I use PAL myself, as well as NTSC-U, what I've been trying to say is that it'll be REALLY hard to find a NTSC-U (Which are the "godlike" coders on this year) be interested in porting it to PAL or NTSC-J, that's where people like Bero comes to the play (Bero's a porter to NTSC-J).

I, at least, don't care about my save data, I only did the Sub Space Emmysary to unlock the characters fast, instead of playing 450 matches to do so, but I know some people do care, but the code makers do the codes for their likings and mst of the time ignore the community because all we're doing is begging for something that they're doing for fun.

On Topic: <.> Nothing 'til I try my ISO. lol

[LC-DDM]

Actually, that brings up an interesting point. Isn't US->JPN porting easier than US->PAL? o_o

[Jaklub]

Actually, that brings up an interesting point. Isn't US->JPN porting easier than US->PAL? o_o

Yes. Probably because of all the additional language data.