Large Leader's PSA's™: Closing!

[KingJigglypuff]

I care because if this is going into the vault as "OoT" Ganondorf, it should reflect what he can actually do and represent the character accurately in anything he's not canonically able to do, otherwise the name is misleading. Minus the weird names in his Smash Bros. moves, Ganondorf has literally nothing to do with dragons. Zant/Stallord may be an argument, but not only is it a huge stretch, it's TP, not OoT. I'm sorry that I don't blindly support things and that constructive criticism is such a bad thing (seems to be a trend at this site). Artistic freedom is fine when you don't have anything to work with, but if you DO have source material, you should work with it. Ganondorf has so much potential without having to invent things.

As for the "it's just two moves" argument: Special moves define a character, and as of Brawl, Final Smashes REALLY define a character. That's why it's important.

I don't mind if he includes it, I just don't like the misleading name. It's not an accurate portrayal.

I'm not blindly supporting anything. And I'm highly critical of various mods even so I withhold extremely high standards. So don't go dismissing me as some white knight. We're trying to be rational here. No one was ever attacking your criticism.

But I see your point. Perhaps he could do a middle ground that would make everyone happy?

[Riddler]

He seems dead set on the dragon, which is fine in itself. The hacker is at liberty to do as they will. Just don't give it a misleading title so that when people download it without having seen this thread (most people) won't wonder why the hell there's a dragon.

@"No one was attacking your criticism"
"I'm not sure why you care so much. But hey, you can't please everyone." "I don't know what the fuss is."
Those are two lines that invalidate my criticism.

[Large Leader]

Ganondorf has so much potential without having to invent things.

I've already listed what Ganondorf accomplishes on-screen and I've told you that I'm including all of it.

I also said that I STILL needed to include some moves to cover up holes.

Right now your "constructive criticism" is a lot like "I don't like how this is because I don't". I've given reasons over and over again stating WHY I'm not taking your criticism and using it, but you keep ignoring it over and over.

Many people I've asked, ranging from complete strangers that I barely met all the way to old friends, all the way to colleagues, agree that the Dragon (at least in Gerudo Dragon) would make a really awesome addition into the moveset. None have said "Ganondorf didn't do that, so don't put it in otherwise I'm going to get mad".

I'm not dismissing your arguments as unimportant or telling you to GTFO. All I'm asking is for you to reevaluate everything we've said (we as in you and I) and see if it's still a glaring problem that would compromise the quality of this moveset.

And most importantly, if it's constructive criticism, give me an ALTERNATIVE. What should I put in instead? Like I said before, I already revealed a large chunk of his moveset. Use that knowledge and tell me what ELSE he could do.

Please don't say "Beast Ganon for FS". I've already taken that into consideration. The current Dragon based final smash along with Beast Ganon final Smash are all tentative depending on File Size constraints.

EDIT: Holy [censored] guys. Let me post lol

[KingJigglypuff]

@"No one was attacking your criticism"
"I'm not sure why you care so much. But hey, you can't please everyone." "I don't know what the fuss is."
Those are two lines that invalidate my criticism.

I was never intending to dismiss your criticism with those statements. My intention was having you elaborate on your statements a bit more. I'm sorry if I made you think otherwise. I'm generally not good with wording stuff.

[Riddler]

My constructive criticism has included alternatives. You can do variations of certain moves and retain the flair you want. Consider a character like Little Mac: If you use just what we know he can do, it leaves a ton of holes. You fill in those holes with variations and assumptions that make sense. In your case, a dragon is only relevant based on the name of one of his moves in Smash Bros. Think of which moves are most important to his character: Shockwave Punch, Energy Ball, Spread-Energy Ball. His shockwave punch is only shown in game to be used on the ground, but that doesn't mean he can't put all of that force into punch directed at an opponent (thus why Warlock Punch makes sense). Using that logic, you've just filled in two spots with a single move. Down-Smash or Down-B can punch into the ground, causing the shockwave, and F-Smash or Side-B can direct that shockwave punch directly into an opponent instead. This same reasoning applies to any of his moves. You've already begun the process of thinking creatively with what he can do and got the spread-energy balls as an up-attack. Keep at it like that. In what other ways can you use his regular energy ball, spread-energy ball, and sword?
Post Merge: November 11, 2014, 04:10:53 PMAnother way you can fill gaps is to take parts of things you know he can do and reuse them in ways you wouldn't normally think, for example:

Up-Tilt: Ganondorf raises his hand draws lightning from multiple directions toward his hand.
In OoT, he does this to create his energy balls. In Smash, it can be assumed safely that he can stop before the energy ball is formed and use it as a quick method of damaging anyone within range of the bolts.

When he gets up after Link smacks the crap out of him, he floats up for a second before stretching all of his limbs with tiny energy particles shooting from his body. That's another thing you can work with.
Post Merge: November 11, 2014, 04:18:03 PMLast little bit of suggestion:
As Ganondorf, before he becomes Ganon, his last resort is to destroy his tower.

https://youtu.be/-yh1g9B_eBY?t=9m3s

When he uses his final smash, he can begin to glow like he does in the video, and do one of a few options. He can let out a giant burst of energy like a lot of hacks do, he can shake the entire screen and damage anyone who's touching the ground, he do multiple Pow-block effects, or he can pit-fall everyone within range followed by a burst.

[Large Leader]

I'm not going to quote and reply to the first part of the post. It's just me, but I don't like reusing attacks and tacking on "it's in a different direction" tag on it. Just a personal preference.

In regards to your up tilt idea. I like it, but I only have two gripes with it:

1. There aren't any good "draw into a source" electricity gfx (at least none that I know of)

2. I'd like to keep his axe kick as well.

BUT, if I find a suitable electricity gfx, I'll include it and move the axe kick to another move.

And that energy thing... I believe that's when Ganon gets shot by a light arrow. I have no idea whether or not that's caused by Ganon's energy or the light arrow, and I'd rather not theorize that in my thread.

[Riddler]

It's not really just putting a tag on it, it's using what he can do in a way you haven't seen. At least with the shockwave punch, you know it can destroy the ground and that it hits a massive area. Who knows the kind of power that would have had if he used it on Link directly?

The energy thing: If you're close enough to it, I'm nearly certain it damages you, so wherever the source comes from it's something to work with. Unless I'm wrong about it damaging you.

I'm  not sure how it works, but if you're using Lucario as a base, doesn't he have graphics you can replace? What are you doing with his force-palm blast?

[Large Leader]

I'm  not sure how it works, but if you're using Lucario as a base, doesn't he have graphics you can replace? What are you doing with his force-palm blast?

He does have GFX to replace. The problem isn't replacing them or being able to. The problem is finding it.
Post Merge: November 11, 2014, 04:38:09 PMI just saw this and I wanted to respond to it.

As Ganondorf, before he becomes Ganon, his last resort is to destroy his tower.

https://youtu.be/-yh1g9B_eBY?t=9m3s

When he uses his final smash, he can begin to glow like he does in the video, and do one of a few options. He can let out a giant burst of energy like a lot of hacks do, he can shake the entire screen and damage anyone who's touching the ground, he do multiple Pow-block effects, or he can pit-fall everyone within range followed by a burst.

Don't want to do a giant burst of energy. It's too overdone and doesn't do anyone or anything justice.
That's kinda the same thing as one, I guess. But maybe initial damage and more damage done over time.
I guess that goes with ^
That kinda goes with the first one.

I'm sure people will enjoy the Final Smash that I have planned. It's not Canon in any way, but I think a lot of people will enjoy it.

[Omniscient X]

I can give you a GFX with lightning that moves toward or is "drawn into" the bone it's attached to for you electrical Up-Tilt.
-Omni

[Large Leader]

I can give you a GFX with lightning that moves toward or is "drawn into" the bone it's attached to for you electrical Up-Tilt.
-Omni

I'd love that.

I might make the Up-Tilt be able to branch off into two moves, if you hold A then you do the axe kick.

Or I might just move that to his Down Air and then make the up tilt the electric attack

[Omniscient X]

Also saw the above "tantrum"-esque posts, while certain members may not be trying to provoke anyone I certainly couldn't care less if I provoke someone.  If you post in someone else's PSA thread its a suggestion and should remain as so, if it becomes a slight discussion that is still admissible but a heated argument does not belong in said thread.

To address the matter at hand I've never played a Zelda game, unless Smash Bros counts, but I think this matter is interesting for discussion, though I take a completely extreme stance on it.  In my opinion PSAs, especially when based on a specific incarnation, need creative new and often "out-of-place" ideas to give it flare.  You give the PSA some nicely incorporated moves from the incarnation at hand to make sure the fanboy rage doesn't flare in your direction, then find some interesting new ways for the character to do some damage.  There is nothing more pleasantly surprising than using a PSA where you think you know everything it could have and suddenly you find out there's some stuff that you didn't even expect to have.  I'll cite Raptor's fireball attack here, and state that I found that to be an extremely enjoyable attack despite the argument I saw erupt because of it.

As for a move being essentially without a past foundation to stand on, as I see it Ganondorf has been given literally every ridiculous power over the years.  He could do a partial-transformation to "Beast Ganon" emit lightning bolts and spam fireballs all at the same time and I for one wouldn't even raise an eyebrow.

Wow, that was quite a rant.

Anyway, I did mention it somewhere in that beast of a post about partial transformations I, for one, would love to see Ganon be able to change his arms or head for an attack, but alas I understand that requires some serious animation syncing and an article slot.
-Omni

[Large Leader]

Anyway, I did mention it somewhere in that beast of a post about partial transformations I, for one, would love to see Ganon be able to change his arms or head for an attack, but alas I understand that requires some serious animation syncing and an article slot.

I think summoning Dragons from Gerudo Dragon and then having the Final Smash are enough for now lol

Man, I can't wait till I start working on the FS. It's going to be EPIC

[highonphazon]

I'm not going to quote and reply to the first part of the post. It's just me, but I don't like reusing attacks and tacking on "it's in a different direction" tag on it. Just a personal preference.

In regards to your up tilt idea. I like it, but I only have two gripes with it:

1. There aren't any good "draw into a source" electricity gfx (at least none that I know of)

2. I'd like to keep his axe kick as well.

BUT, if I find a suitable electricity gfx, I'll include it and move the axe kick to another move.

And that energy thing... I believe that's when Ganon gets shot by a light arrow. I have no idea whether or not that's caused by Ganon's energy or the light arrow, and I'd rather not theorize that in my thread.

I liked Omni's thunder gfx that he used on Thor. I think if you mod the animation a bit and add a cool sound effect it could work. Also have some asynchronous timers timed a few frames apart to replicate the effect. Just a thought.

[Large Leader]

KCMM is 503ing so damn hard...

Anyways...

I've animated a whole bunch of other moves, but they all require editing in brawlbox before I can show them off.

So here's an animation that I don't need to change in Brawlbox that I can show off to ya'll.



It's Ganondorf Float ability. It'll be mapped to his up special. He'll be able to interrupt it into any aerial attack and then quickly go back into his float. BUT he has a time limit before he can no longer float and will have to land for it to start recharging.

The next move that I'll be showing off is his F-Air and possibly his D-Air as well.

[StupidMarioFan1]

Since it sounds like you want him to be able to float like Peach, make sure to look at her moveset if you need help with that. Anyways loving this.