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Author Topic: Super Smash Bros. All Stars (Teaser: Lucas, Popo & Nana)  (Read 134501 times)
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Akeno/Archer
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    « Reply #285 on: December 17, 2013, 11:46:59 AM »


    Yeah, "broken" would have been a better choice of words.

    ...But yes, the game is still broken. If you make every character effortlessly good, skill goes right out the window. Making every character broken doesn't equate to "balance". Consider the extreme: If each character had a fast one-hit-KO move, nothing would really matter.

    Minus is nifty, but... it's not authentic. Have you ever played one of your favorite games with all the cheat codes turned on, and then, after an hour or so of gameplay, notice just how much it cheapens the experience? That's what Minus is like for me.

    I hear the point of Minus was to lift up every character to Meta Knight levels. I've seen gameplay of Ike and he has waaaaaaaaaay more potential than MK ever did. It's broken to the point of excess; it's fun and all, but it's not competitive. And competition is what truly fuels the Smash scene.
    Yes?
    Well... Let's just say that they have different point of views, the PMBR and Minus MAX teams, that is. Both are fun to play, and even if I prefer Minus, it doesn't mean that I can't enjoy Project M.
    Look guys point is everyone has there own opinion some like minus other like project m and a few people like both for different reasons.

    My personal opinion on the two mods are that project m is a great competitive game and helped me learn how to be a better player. But minus on the other hand is generally fun to play and easier to make character changes fitting to minus if you know how.To me they are both fun.So what do I do? just enjoy both.
    This will most Likely not be your own opinion.but please let's not argue about each others opinions because doing so will not achieve anything.maybe be talking about amarythe's movesets will be more worth while than arguing about two mods that attempt to achieve different goals
    Well... Just ^THIS^ is enough to make a summary of this little off topic... But don't forget that there are people who likes both PM and B-
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    "Atone for my sins? I don't have any sins to atone for nor have I forced such a meaningless concept on anyone." -Archer
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    « Reply #286 on: December 17, 2013, 11:52:26 AM »


    Yes?

    Awesome.
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    Akeno/Archer
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    « Reply #287 on: December 17, 2013, 04:00:39 PM »


    Awesome.
    Our boy
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    « Reply #288 on: December 17, 2013, 05:23:41 PM »


    Lol guys, don't worry about keeping my thread on page 1, errr, I mean discussing this in the meantime. We've all got our preferences and there's nothing wrong with publicly ranting about them here, haha. Discussion about my PSAs will naturally increase again once I release even more new material, so don't worry 'bout it.

    Awesome.
    [censored]chyeah.
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    Super Smash Brothers: All Stars is currently looking for new recruits!
    SSB:AS is a project dedicated to filling Project M with as much canon material as possible. The aim is to cram the game with movesets, textures, stages, and easter-eggs which accurately reflect each character's abilities from their respective franchises. If you are a relatively skilled hacker with an interest in helping achieve this concept, please visit the official thread by clicking on the banner, or contact me via private message. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

    We need:
    Skilled animators, Advanced PSA specialists, Coders for Special Attacks, Proficient Modelers/Importers, Adept Stage Makers, Graphic Artists for Menus/Portraits, Play-Testers and Glitch-Finders!

    *All applicants must come equipped with their own pair of nostalgia goggles

    Akeno/Archer
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    « Reply #289 on: December 18, 2013, 05:35:15 AM »


    Lol guys, don't worry about keeping my thread on page 1, errr, I mean discussing this in the meantime. We've all got our preferences and there's nothing wrong with publicly ranting about them here, haha. Discussion about my PSAs will naturally increase again once I release even more new material, so don't worry 'bout it.
    [censored]chyeah.
    Lol... Someone tolerant about off topics... That's rare...
    Though it's not entirely off-topic since you're making these with PM as a base.
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    "Atone for my sins? I don't have any sins to atone for nor have I forced such a meaningless concept on anyone." -Archer
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    « Reply #290 on: December 18, 2013, 11:13:24 AM »


    So I finally got around testing this and while the a lot of it looks really good, some of the animations are lazily done and seem really bad.

    Here's my individual complaints

    All: None of the characters have the animation that leads into a Smash Attack. It looks horribly unprofessional and makes a lot of the animations really really bad.

    Meta Knight: In games, he's actually slightly larger than Kirby as he was in Brawl. In the True Series he's smaller than Kirby. I suggest you revert him to his older size.

    Toon Link: Standard attack should have been kept the same since it's his main attack in Wind Waker. Up Smash goes too fast and the animation is just a copy paste. His neutral aerial should be faster. Otherwise it's useless in an actual battle.

    Captain Falcon: Aside from the All problem, he's fine. Combos well too.

    Link: His standard combo is not a Zelda combo at all. Link swings his sword downward only after swinging it side to side. Although his forward tilt is actually really fun. His forward air is also good, the animation however is a copypaste which is also unprofessional. The boomerang animation looks weird, could just be Project M but I don't think that's it.

    Ike: His wait animations and taunt don't go well with his idle. It looks really weird...

    Ganondorf: Brawl didn't represent him right, but you didn't either. Ganondorf loves to punch and choke people in Zelda games. His power comes from his fist afterall. My suggestion is that you make his moveset more punch based. Trust me on this one, Zelda is my favorite game series of all time, I studied the [censored] out of it and I'd probably be a professor if that was a subject

    Roy: Fun, same animation problem as Ike, otherwise it's perfect.

    Bowser: Same animation problem as everyone else, the punch move is really strong but still nice and pretty easy to see coming.


    Final Verdict: I give this a C-. It has potential and you seem to enjoy doing this, but if you ever want people to actually get hooked into this, you'll have to start working ten times as hard. I suggest you form a team of animators to help you. This is a project you can't do alone my friend.
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    « Reply #291 on: December 18, 2013, 08:04:55 PM »


    Thanks for the in-depth feedback, very much appreciated. I want you to know that, because P:M 3.0 was released, all of these hacks are getting MAJOR overhauls. Like, starting from scratch overhauls. I've learned much about PSA and BB since starting this project, so sexy improvements are sure to come.

    All: None of the characters have the animation that leads into a Smash Attack. It looks horribly unprofessional and makes a lot of the animations really really bad.
    "None" is too extreme, many characters have the transition but your complaint is totally legitimate. Unless you're complaining about the fact that the "Charge" animation is a freeze-frame; that's not changing. Meant to emulate Melee, and stream-line the development process. But yes, this is a major concern that will be addressed in the overhaul.

    Meta Knight: In games, he's actually slightly larger than Kirby as he was in Brawl. In the True Series he's smaller than Kirby. I suggest you revert him to his older size.
    Nope. Kirby's being made smaller to accommodate Meta Knight's change in size. Meta Knight is just RIDICULOUSLY huge in Brawl.

    The first release of SSB:AS will include proper size mods for every character who has a size-mod planned. This will mainly apply to MK, Kirby, R.O.B., Bulbasaur, Wartortle and Bowser among a few others.

    Toon Link: Standard attack should have been kept the same since it's his main attack in Wind Waker. Up Smash goes too fast and the animation is just a copy paste. His neutral aerial should be faster. Otherwise it's useless in an actual battle.
    Again, nope, kinda nope, and nope.
    1. The Standard Attack comes straight from nearly all the major top-down Zelda games. Won't keep P:M's jab because the final hit is planned as his new Up Tilt. That being said...
    2. Up Smash is being changed to Up Tilt. Balancing issues will be addressed, so don't worry I gotcha.
    3. Concerning the NAir, definitely not changing it. It's a fantastic move with an extremely versatile hitbox and considerable killing power. If the move doesn't work well for you it means you've got to learn to space it properly.

    Surprised you said nothing about the Pegasus Dash.

    Captain Falcon: Aside from the All problem, he's fine. Combos well too.
    Yeah, that Forward Smash transition is glaring. No wonder you had few complaints, Captain Falcon had very few changes applied.

    Link: His standard combo is not a Zelda combo at all. Link swings his sword downward only after swinging it side to side. Although his forward tilt is actually really fun. His forward air is also good, the animation however is a copypaste which is also unprofessional. The boomerang animation looks weird, could just be Project M but I don't think that's it.
    Jab - It's actually ridiculously Zelda. Comes straight from Ocarina of time, it's LITERALLY his standard combo. L-Target and B-B-B = This Link's Jab.
    Forward Tilt - This move is actually getting changed, lololol. Get ready for the Shield Bash.
    Forward Air - Copy/Paste isn't unprofessional if it looks good. I don't care to animate something from scratch if I can achieve 95% the same effect through practical means.
    Boomerang - This move actually IS Project M, lol. Don't blame me!! Will be fixed, since P:M 3.0 fixed it, so don't worry.

    Surprised you said nothing about the Side Smash, which has no lift off the ground, or his Down Smash, which is just the tiniest bit overpowered and has an awkward trajectory.

    Ike: His wait animations and taunt don't go well with his idle. It looks really weird...
    Already noted, Ike's animations deserve a major cleanup. He was my first PSA ever released and much of his material reflects my very, very early work.

    Ganondorf: Brawl didn't represent him right, but you didn't either. Ganondorf loves to punch and choke people in Zelda games. His power comes from his fist afterall. My suggestion is that you make his moveset more punch based. Trust me on this one, Zelda is my favorite game series of all time, I studied the [censored] out of it and I'd probably be a professor if that was a subject
    Ganondorf has never ONCE punched someone in a Zelda game (unless you coun't his OoT thunder-slam thingy, which usually connects from the shockwave rather than the punch). Or choked them, for that matter. The only truly "melee" style attack Ganondorf has EVER performed in a game was the Sparta Kick in Twilight Princess. Correct me if I'm wrong.

    HOWEVER, as it stands Ganondorf WILL receive one-or-three more fist based changes, so you're good. AND, his grab has some delicious changes in store, which will ceeeeertainly cater to your complaint of a lack of choking.

    Roy: Fun, same animation problem as Ike, otherwise it's perfect.
    Niiiiice. Yeah, the Idle Animation was rushed in order to cater to more the more practical ideas involved. Of course this is going to be changed, haha. Notice how my latest hack is the most "perfect" so far? Haha, glad that means I've improved.

    Although it's not perfect, slight glitch in the NAir makes him turn around. Easy fix.

    Bowser: Same animation problem as everyone else, the punch move is really strong but still nice and pretty easy to see coming.
    The Side Smash was actually unchanged in terms of it's P:M speed... which is strange, because for some reason it feels slower. Don't worry, this will be balanced appropriately. REAL surprised you didn't mention the glitch that cause the enemy to fly straight upward with little damage (I know how to fix it, haha).


    Final Verdict: I give this a C-. It has potential and you seem to enjoy doing this, but if you ever want people to actually get hooked into this, you'll have to start working ten times as hard. I suggest you form a team of animators to help you. This is a project you can't do alone my friend.
    Dayumn, would have like at least a C+. It helps my case that I could counter a good chunk of your complaints though. Don't worry, with the planned updates things we'll be much smoother.

    I'd very much love to get a team going, but frankly I don't know who to/how to ask and I assume my ideal team members are very busy with their own projects. That being said, for Specials specifically, I will be requesting help. At this stage working alone isn't a big deal, but you're correct, sometime down the line that'll have to change. Some competent animators have actually made tiny changes here and there to my stuff on their own, haha. Pretty nifty little contributions.

    And hey, the fact that I've gotten this far alone is, I think, pretty commendable, haha.

    Again, thanks a ton for the feedback. It's always welcome and helps shape my perspective on needed improvements.
    « Last Edit: December 18, 2013, 08:09:13 PM by Amarythe » Logged


    Super Smash Brothers: All Stars is currently looking for new recruits!
    SSB:AS is a project dedicated to filling Project M with as much canon material as possible. The aim is to cram the game with movesets, textures, stages, and easter-eggs which accurately reflect each character's abilities from their respective franchises. If you are a relatively skilled hacker with an interest in helping achieve this concept, please visit the official thread by clicking on the banner, or contact me via private message. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

    We need:
    Skilled animators, Advanced PSA specialists, Coders for Special Attacks, Proficient Modelers/Importers, Adept Stage Makers, Graphic Artists for Menus/Portraits, Play-Testers and Glitch-Finders!

    *All applicants must come equipped with their own pair of nostalgia goggles

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    « Reply #292 on: December 19, 2013, 09:04:29 AM »


    Dayumn, would have like at least a C+. It helps my case that I could counter a good chunk of your complaints though. Don't worry, with the planned updates things we'll be much smoother.

    I'll give you an F for fabulous. Really, you managed to do all of this, ALONE. That my sir deserves a nice round of applause. Now, about Falco. The Project M thread suffered a slight debated on whenever Falco should be decloned or not. Think you can pull of an True Falco fo pm?
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    « Reply #293 on: December 19, 2013, 03:35:51 PM »


    I'll give you an F for fabulous. Really, you managed to do all of this, ALONE. That my sir deserves a nice round of applause. Now, about Falco. The Project M thread suffered a slight debated on whenever Falco should be decloned or not. Think you can pull of an True Falco fo pm?
    Naturally. I've got you guys covered. And thanks man!

    I don't necessarily think Project M made the wrong decision in keeping Falco faithful to Melee, since... that's what P:M is all about, basically recreating Melee. I suppose my hack set is more in line with what I wish Melee was like originally.

    Fox and Falco's PSA's will be released in tandem with one another, because both characters are involved in the de-cloning process. Don't fret over Fox getting changed, most of his attacks will remain.

    I want to hit this PSA soon, since De-Cloning is a great addition to the planned hackset. First attempt to edit Falco's motion file caused freezing. o_o Bad first impression made me put it off, haha
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    Super Smash Brothers: All Stars is currently looking for new recruits!
    SSB:AS is a project dedicated to filling Project M with as much canon material as possible. The aim is to cram the game with movesets, textures, stages, and easter-eggs which accurately reflect each character's abilities from their respective franchises. If you are a relatively skilled hacker with an interest in helping achieve this concept, please visit the official thread by clicking on the banner, or contact me via private message. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

    We need:
    Skilled animators, Advanced PSA specialists, Coders for Special Attacks, Proficient Modelers/Importers, Adept Stage Makers, Graphic Artists for Menus/Portraits, Play-Testers and Glitch-Finders!

    *All applicants must come equipped with their own pair of nostalgia goggles

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    « Reply #294 on: December 19, 2013, 03:48:53 PM »


    Will you be doing one one of these for Mewtwo?I'm curious what arieals you can come up with since he can hover.
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    « Reply #295 on: December 19, 2013, 10:59:11 PM »


    Ganondorf slammed his fist backwards in the same manner as Brawl in Wind Waker. Ganondorf has slapped Tetra multiple times in the same game. Ganondorf also chokes to find out if females have the triforce or not. Not just that but he also holds them in the air exactly like in Brawl.

    Also you're right about the Link things so props on that. Anyways with your counter arguments I give this a B- instead. Also I didn't find a lot glitches and those are easily fixable so I didn't talk about them cause I figured you already knew about them. I mostly aimed for the "trueness" of the project. Anyways once you're done I hope you make the animations a little more Brawl-like. Until then the Meleeness is fine. Also Olimar is smaller than Kirby and Meta Knight and I hope that you eventually add charge animations.

    Seriously dude, great job. And I hope you manage to find a team soon or later. If not you're doing just fine on your own.
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    « Reply #296 on: December 20, 2013, 11:16:33 AM »


    Will you be doing one one of these for Mewtwo?I'm curious what arieals you can come up with since he can hover.
    Eventually, yes. I'll have to get creative with this one...

    Ganondorf slammed his fist backwards in the same manner as Brawl in Wind Waker. Ganondorf has slapped Tetra multiple times in the same game. Ganondorf also chokes to find out if females have the triforce or not. Not just that but he also holds them in the air exactly like in Brawl.
    Ah, generally I wasn't taking cut-scenes into account when I was making animations. I'll have to take another look at Wind Waker again...

    Also you're right about the Link things so props on that. Anyways with your counter arguments I give this a B- instead. Also I didn't find a lot glitches and those are easily fixable so I didn't talk about them cause I figured you already knew about them. I mostly aimed for the "trueness" of the project. Anyways once you're done I hope you make the animations a little more Brawl-like. Until then the Meleeness is fine. Also Olimar is smaller than Kirby and Meta Knight and I hope that you eventually add charge animations.
    Oooooh, thanks man. B- sounds a lot better, haha! Even so, there are still some tinges of amateurism in certain hacks, so I've got a long way to go.

    Olimar's getting a size mod too, don't worry lol.

    Seriously dude, great job. And I hope you manage to find a team soon or later. If not you're doing just fine on your own.
    Cool
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    Super Smash Brothers: All Stars is currently looking for new recruits!
    SSB:AS is a project dedicated to filling Project M with as much canon material as possible. The aim is to cram the game with movesets, textures, stages, and easter-eggs which accurately reflect each character's abilities from their respective franchises. If you are a relatively skilled hacker with an interest in helping achieve this concept, please visit the official thread by clicking on the banner, or contact me via private message. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

    We need:
    Skilled animators, Advanced PSA specialists, Coders for Special Attacks, Proficient Modelers/Importers, Adept Stage Makers, Graphic Artists for Menus/Portraits, Play-Testers and Glitch-Finders!

    *All applicants must come equipped with their own pair of nostalgia goggles

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    « Reply #297 on: December 21, 2013, 02:03:34 PM »


    Hey Amarythe, do you plan on doing True versions of all the characters for your mod, or just some of them?

    P.S. Did you ever get that Vanguard model you sent me to work at all?
    « Last Edit: December 21, 2013, 02:04:38 PM by heavyd88 » Logged

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    « Reply #298 on: December 21, 2013, 05:03:26 PM »


    Also about Toon Link's moveset... OBJECTION! Link's standard attack in top down Zelda games are horizontal slashes, not vertical.

    Pegasus boots were fun actually, not for competition but I don't see this as a very competitive esque mod.
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    « Reply #299 on: December 21, 2013, 06:25:48 PM »


    Hey Amarythe, do you plan on doing True versions of all the characters for your mod, or just some of them?

    P.S. Did you ever get that Vanguard model you sent me to work at all?
    All characters, although some characters will have very few changes.

    And once that's completed, work will begin on anywhere from 6-9 brand new Characters meant to optionally be .rel ported over certain characters. And, the PMBR may be adding 5 more characters into the game through use of their clone engine, so I may have even more material to work with.

    About Ike, I can't get the model to work. I'm waiting on the hack's author(s) to fix the problem. >_> Hopefully they can fix the problem because I want that hack really bad.

    Also about Toon Link's moveset... OBJECTION! Link's standard attack in top down Zelda games are horizontal slashes, not vertical.
    ...But Toon Link's standard attack IS a horizontal slash!

    Pegasus boots were fun actually, not for competition but I don't see this as a very competitive esque mod.
    The Pegasus Boots are no less unbalanced than Sonic's Forward Special. The range is a little crazy but so is the startup lag (so if you're paying attention, it's basically impossible not to predict the attack). The hacks are in fact designed to be realistically competitive. I know some of the attacks seem rather intense at times, but for the most part the game still appreciates a sense of balance.

    That being said these are beta releases, meaning there are naturally many balancing issues to deal with. It's to be expected, even finished PSAs and official Smash material suffers from slight kinks in balancing.
    « Last Edit: December 22, 2013, 10:58:17 AM by Amarythe » Logged


    Super Smash Brothers: All Stars is currently looking for new recruits!
    SSB:AS is a project dedicated to filling Project M with as much canon material as possible. The aim is to cram the game with movesets, textures, stages, and easter-eggs which accurately reflect each character's abilities from their respective franchises. If you are a relatively skilled hacker with an interest in helping achieve this concept, please visit the official thread by clicking on the banner, or contact me via private message. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

    We need:
    Skilled animators, Advanced PSA specialists, Coders for Special Attacks, Proficient Modelers/Importers, Adept Stage Makers, Graphic Artists for Menus/Portraits, Play-Testers and Glitch-Finders!

    *All applicants must come equipped with their own pair of nostalgia goggles

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