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Author Topic: The problem of SFX: a thread for brainstorming solutions  (Read 13299 times)
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« on: January 16, 2016, 04:27:33 PM »

as things stand, we have everything we could ever want for hacking. we have an expanded stage select with up to 78 stages, potentially more.  We have a roster up to 100 characters, and we have...sfx...

that is the one final hurdle to finally having complete customization power. as things stand, while we can add 100 characters, we can only add a few COMPLETE characters. why? because there are only so many boss slots to go around.

this thread is where we look for a solution. here are the tools we have so far:

file patch code 4.0: https://br4wlbreakers.wordpress.com/2009/10/29/new-filepatcher-code-4-0-beta/
               super buggy supposedly. if someone could work on this...

file patch 3.5.3: http://forums.kc-mm.com/index.php?topic=51912.0

                allows for multiple hack folders and switching, but can't load multiple at a time.

 - the replacement soundbank engine: http://forums.kc-mm.com/index.php?topic=61460.0
               this code allows you to replace entire soundbanks using .sawnd files

-the custom sound engine: http://smashboards.com/threads/cse-custom-sound-engine-v2-5-works-with-geckoos-and-riivolution.300069/
               this code allows you to insert music without replacing any.

Oshtoby's music replacment codes (for use with th custom sound engine):
Stage Dependent Song Loader (oshtoby)
28708ceb 000000SS
4A000000 90180F06
14000076 FF00MMMM
E0000000 80008000
SS is the stage. MMMM is the song ID. One song per stage.

Or (if you want more than one song for a custom stage):
Stage-Track Dependant Song Loader [Oshtoby]
28708ceb 000000SS
28708d2e 0000XXXX
4A000000 90180F06
14000076 FF00YYYY
E0000000 80008000
XXXX is the song you want to replace. YYYY is the new song.

01 - Battlefield
02 - Final Destination
03 - Delfino Plaza
04 - Luigi's Mansion
05 - Mushroomy Kingdom
06 - Mario Circuit
07 - 75m
08 - Rumble Falls
09 - Pirate Ship
0B - Norfair
0C - Frigate Orpheon
0D - Yoshi's Island
0E - Halberd
13 - Lylat Cruise
14 - Pokémon Stadium 2
15 - Spear Pillar
16 - Port Town Aero Dive
17 - Summit
18 - Flat Zone 2
19 - Castle Siege
1C - WarioWare, Inc.
1D - Distant Planet
1E - Skyworld
1F - Mario Bros.
20 - New Pork City
21 - Smashville
22 - Shadow Moses Island
23 - Green Hill Zone
24 - PictoChat
25 - Hanenbow
26 - Config Test
28 - Results Screen
29 - Temple
2A - Yoshi's Island (Melee)
2B - Jungle Japes
2C - Onett
2D - Green Greens
2E - Pokémon Stadium
2F - Rainbow Cruise
30 - Corneria
31 - Big Blue
32 - Brinstar
33 - Bridge of Eldin
34 - Home Run Contest
35 - "Edit" (CRASH)
36 - All-Star Waiting Room
37 - Wi-Fi Waiting Room
38 - Break the Targets

26F9 Menu 1
26FA Menu 1
26FB Menu 2
26FC Battlefield
26FD Final Destination
26FF Online Practice Stage
2700 Results Display Screen
2701 Tournament Registration
2702 Tournament Grid
2703 Tournament Match End
2705 Classic: Results Screen
2707 All-Star Rest Area
2708 Home-Run Contest
2709 Cruel Brawl
270A Boss Battle
270B Trophy Gallery
270C Sticker Album / Album / Chronicle
270D Coin Launcher
270F Stage Builder
2712 Target Smash!!
2713 Credits
2714 Ground Theme (Super Mario Bros.)
2715 Underground Theme (Super Mario Bros.)
2716 Underwater Theme (Super Mario Bros.)
2717 Underground Theme (Super Mario Land)
2718 Airship Theme (Super Mario Bros. 3)
2719 Castle / Boss Fortress (Super Mario World / SMB 3)
271A Title / Ending (Super Mario World)
271B Main Theme (New Super Mario Bros.)
271C Luigi's Mansion Theme
271D Gritzy Desert
271E MLRPG02 (Unused)
2720 Delfino Plaza
2721 Ricco Harbor
2722 Main Theme (Super Mario 64)
2723 Ground Theme 2 (Super Mario Bros.)
2724 Mario Bros.
2725 Mario Circuit
2726 Luigi Circuit
2727 Waluigi Pinball
2728 Rainbow Road
2729 Jungle Level Ver.2
272A The Map Page / Bonus Level
272B Opening (Donkey Kong)
272C Donkey Kong
272D King K.Rool / Ship Deck 2
272E Bramble Blast
272F Battle for Storm Hill
2730 Jungle Level
2731 25m BGM
2732 DK Jungle 1 Theme (Barrel Blast)
2733 Title (The Legend of Zelda)
2734 Main Theme (The Legend of Zelda)
2735 Great Temple / Temple
2736 The Dark World
2737 Hidden Mountain & Forest
2738 KAZENOSAKANA (Unused)
2739 Tal Tal Heights
273A Hyrule Field Theme
273B Ocarina of Time Medley
273C Song of Storms
273D Molgera Battle
273E Village of the Blue Maiden
273F Gerudo Valley
2740 Termina Field
2741 Dragon Roost Island
2742 The Great Sea
2743 Main Theme (Twilight Princess)
2744 The Hidden Village
2745 Midna's Lament
2746 Main Theme (Metroid)
2747 Norfair
2748 Ending (Metroid)
2749 Vs. Ridley
274A Theme of Samus Aran, Space Warrior
274B Sector 1
274C Opening / Menu (Metroid Prime)
274D Vs. Parasite Queen
274E Vs. Meta Ridley
274F Multiplayer (Metroid Prime 2)
2750 Ending (Yoshi's Story)
2751 Obstacle Course
2752 Yoshi's Island
2753 [censored]IE (Unused)
2754 Flower Field
2755 Wildlands
2756 ATHLETIC2 (Unused)
2757 The Legendary Air Ride Machine
2758 King Dedede's Theme
2759 Boss Theme Medley
275A Butter Building
275B Gourmet Race
275C Meta Knight's Revenge
275D Vs. Marx
275E 0 Battle
275F Forest / Nature Area
2760 Checker Knights
2761 Frozen Hillside
2762 Squeak Squad Theme
2763 Main Theme (Star Fox)
2764 Corneria
2765 Main Theme (Star Fox 64)
2766 Area 6
2767 Star Wolf
2768 COMMAND (Unused)
2769 Space Battleground
276A Break Through the Ice
276B Star Wolf (Star Fox: Assault)
276C Space Armada
276D Area 6 Ver. 2
276E Pokémon Main Theme
276F Pokémon Center
2770 Road to Viridian City (From Pallet Town / Pewter City)
2771 Pokémon Gym / Evolution
2772 Wild Pokémon Battle! (Ruby / Sapphire)
2773 Victory Road
2774 Wild Pokémon Battle! (Diamond / Pearl)
2775 Dialga / Palkia Battle at Spear Pillar!
2776 Team Galactic Battle!
2777 Route 209
2778 Mute City
2779 White Land
277A Fire Field
277B Car Select
277C Dream Chaser
277D Devil's Call in Your Heart
277E Climb Up! And Get The Last Chance!
277F Brain Cleaner
2780 Shotgun Kiss
2781 Planet Colors
2783 Fire Emblem Theme
2784 Shadow Dragon Medley
2785 With Mila's Divine Protection (Celica Map 1)
2787 Preparing to Advance
2788 Winning Road - Roy's Hope
2789 Attack
278A Against the Dark Knight
278B Crimean Army Sortie
278C Power-Hungry Fool
278D Victory Is Near
278E Ike's Theme
278F Snowman
2793 Humoresque of a Little Dog
2794 BECAUSE (Unused)
2795 Porky's Theme
2796 Mother 3 Love Theme
2797 Unfounded Revenge / Smashing Song of Praise
2798 You Call This a Utopia?!
2799 World Map (Pikmin 2)
279A Forest of Hope
279B Environmental Noises
279C Ai no Uta
279D Tane no Uta
279E Main Theme (Pikmin)
279F Stage Clear / Title (Pikmin)
27A0 Ai no Uta (French Version)
27A1 WarioWare, Inc.
27A2 WarioWare, Inc. Medley
27A3 Mona Pizza's Song (Japanese Version)
27A4 Mona Pizza's Song (English Version)
27A5 Mike's Song (Japanese Version)
27A6 Mike's Song (English Version)
27A7 Ashley's Song (Japanese Version)
27A8 Ashley's Song (English Version)
27B3 Title (Animal Crossing)
27B4 Go K.K. Rider!
27B5 2:00 a.m.
27B6 RADIOTAISO (Unused)
27B7 The Roost
27B8 Town Hall and Tom Nook's Store
27B9 K.K. Crusin'
27BA K.K. Western
27BB K.K. Gumbo
27BC Rockin' K.K.
27BD DJ K.K.
27BE K.K. Condor
27BF Underworld
27C0 Title (Kid Icarus)
27C1 Skyworld
27C2 Kid Icarus Original Medley
27C3 Famicom Medley
27C4 Gyromite
27C6 Chill (Dr. Mario)
27C7 Clu Clu Land
27C8 Balloon Trip
27C9 Ice Climber
27CA Shin Onigashima
27CB Title (3D Hot Rally)
27CC Tetris: Type A
27CD Tetris: Type B
27CE Tunnel Scene (X)
27CF Power-Up Music
27D0 Douchuumen (Nazo no Murasamejo)
27D1 WILDTRACKS (Unused)
27D2 PictoChat
27D4 Flat Zone 2
27D5 Mario Tennis / Mario Golf
27D6 Lip's Theme (Panel de Pon)
27D7 Marionation Gear
27D8 Title (Big Brain Academy)
27D9 Golden Forest (1080Snowboarding)
27DA Mii Channel
27DB Wii Shop Channel
27DC Battle Scene / Final Boss (Golden Sun)
27DD Shaberu! DS Cooking Navi
27DE Excite Truck
27DF Brain Age: Train Your Brain in Minutes a Day
27E0 Opening Theme (Wii Sports)
27E1 Charge! (Wii Play)
27E2 MAINTHEME (Unused)
27E3 Encounter
27E4 Theme of Tara
27E5 Yell "Dead Cell"
27E6 Snake Eater (Instrumental)
27E7 MGS4 Theme of Love Smash Bros. Brawl Version
27E8 Cavern
27E9 Battle in the Base
27EB Theme of Solid Snake
27EC Calling to the Night
27ED Credits (Super Smash Bros.)
27EE Menu (Super Smash Bros. Melee)
27EF Opening (Super Smash Bros. Melee)
27F0 HOWTOPLAY (Unused)
27F1 DXTERMINAL (Unused)
27F2 Green Hill Zone
27F3 Scrap Brain Zone
27F4 Emerald Hill Zone
27F5 Angel Island Zone
27F7 Sonic Boom
27F8 Super Sonic Racing
27F9 Open Your Heart
27FA Live & Learn
27FB Sonic Heroes
27FC Right There, Ride On
27FD HIS WORLD (Instrumental)
27FE Seven Rings In Hand
27FF Princess Peach's Castle (Melee)
2800 Rainbow Cruise (Melee)
2801 Jungle Japes (Melee)
2802 Brinstar Depths (Melee)
2803 Yoshi's Island (Melee)
2804 Fountain of Dreams (Melee)
2805 Green Greens (Melee)
2806 Corneria (Melee)
2807 Pokémon Stadium (Melee)
2808 Poké Floats (Melee)
2809 Big Blue (Melee)
280A Mother (Melee)
280B Icicle Mountain (Melee)
280C Flat Zone (Melee)
280D Super Mario Bros. 3 (Melee)
280E Battle Theme (Melee)
280F Fire Emblem (Melee)
2810 Mach Rider (Melee)
2811 Mother 2 (Melee)
2812 Dr. Mario (Melee)
2813 Battlefield (Melee)
2815 Multi-Man Melee 1 (Melee)
2816 Temple (Melee)
2817 Final Destination (Melee)
2818 Kong Jungle (Melee)
2819 Brinstar (Melee)
281A Venom (Melee)
281B Mute City (Melee)
281C Menu (Melee)
281D Giga Bowser (Melee)
281F Adventure Map
2820 Step: The Plain
2821 Step: The Cave
2822 Step: Subspace
2823 Boss Battle Song 1
2824 SSE Results (Nameless)
2825 Boss Battle Song 2
2826 Save Point
2827 SSE DK Jungle (Nameless)
2828 SSE Luigi Mansion (Nameless)
2829 Halberd Interior (Nameless)
282A SSE Data Select (Nameless)
282B SSE Brinstar (Nameless)
282C Step: Subspace Ver.2
282D Step: Subspace Ver.3
282E Halberd Moving (Nameless)[/collapse]

the problem we seem to have is the limited number of boss soundbanks. one solution would to be to "create"
soundbanks. we wouldn't have to actually add more sounds to the brsar. Is there any way we can get a code so that characters read sawnd files directly? for example, Robo is soundbank 319. could we have a 319A.sawnd and a 319B.sawnd in our directory?

alternatively, what about a character-dependent brsar loader? when the game calls character A, it loads soundbank 319 (robo) from brsarA and when it loads character B it loads brsarB. just so long as the sounds are not called at the same time it should be fine.

please note, I am not a programmer. I'm intermediate at best. I'm only brainstorming concepts for others to jump off of here.

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« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2016, 10:51:24 PM »

Don Jon Bravo posted a hypothetical solution to where the Sound effects folder would be swapped to a custom folder so they'd be loaded when a character above 3F is selected. The issue is Brawl seems to load sounds very strangely I've made a few mods of his initial soundbank engine to change every instance of the SFX folder loaded into memory, and it works to an extent but only if the clone is the only character using said sound bank, and even that is finicky at best.

From what I've found swapping folders, or loading two files with the same group ID is impossible using this method unless someone figures out how to alter it at very deep level beyond my own abilities.

Another Idea I had, a simple concept but it'd be really difficult to implement would be to have a clone load a soundbank group that currently isn't used by other fighters since there are 36+ characters and through normal means only 4 can be loaded. That leaves a whopping 32 whole soundbanks available at any point in time using folder swapping and RSBE.

The main issues with this are
1. Each clone would need at least 4 sawnd+PSAs for each soundbank
2. There would need to be about 4 fighterconfigs for each clone and a means to swap those around. (Not sure when the Fighterconfig file is loaded into memory)

The way it'd work though is say you want a fight between Marth and Cloned Roy, instead of loading Marth's soundfont he'd load Mario's since Mario isn't in play. If Player 3 was Mario than Roy would load Donkey Kong's and if Player 4 is DK than Roy would load Link's or something.

I'm not the best programmer either and I have NO idea how to configure PSAs and soundbanks to load different voices, but it in theory would work since there'd be no soundbank ID conflicts.


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« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2016, 02:25:13 AM »

the only problem with your first idea is that we would still be limited with how many sounds we could replace. rather than any character above 3F, such a code should be more like ~ every 6 characters ( we have only so many boss banks). This of course means conflicts between clone "groups" though it does free the original characters up at least.

your second idea is probably the superior one in my opinion. the only issue I can see is how much space it uses up on the SD (though there IS an SDHC code for big sd cards, though I think it may be only for project M. could be wrong). the tricky bit would be making it work with the current codes. You need 4 sawnds...named the same. that means either an new naming convention for the custom sound engine or a new folder set up such that the code reads one folder or another for each character individually (if sounds are all loaded at once, this fails for the same reason as your first idea, but if not we have a character dependent sound loader much like we have a stage dependent song loader!

I can see the code acting like this:
check if character 3F is loaded. if no, end. if yes
check if Soundbank A is loaded. if no, inject sawndA from folder 3Fsounds and load soundbank A. if yes,
check if Soundbank B is loaded. if no, inject sawndB from folder 3Fsounds and  load soundbank B. if yes,
check if Soundbank C is loaded. if no, inject sawndC from folder 3Fsounds and  load soundbank C. if yes,
inject sawndD from folder 3Fsounds and load soundbank D

my idea is that if we could trick the game into thinking there are more sound IDs than there are, we could create virtual soundbanks. no need to actually use a sawnd to replace a bank. rather we get the game to look for a soundbank number that doesn't exist and instruct it to check the SD card first. problem here is currently sawnds are designed as a sort of "injection". I don't think they are read directly. if we could find some way to export soundbanks into there own file type...

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« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2016, 06:24:21 PM »

I thought of a way it would work fairly simply and it wouldn't even replace Boss Soundbanks. Now this all relies on whether or not I can swap the Fighterconfig folder and have multiple files load. If it does work I'll be able to set up a careful combination that would basically use 4 soundfonts per character and alter what is loaded so there are no conflicts with other clones by checking which characters are currently selected.

I'll probably try to whip up a fighterconfig swapping code to test the concept the following weeks, if it works there is a chance we can have a sound engine without having to expand the current one, or entirely replace the original voices. I'll keep you updated with my progress.


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« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2016, 09:09:22 PM »

any progress on that code?

actually, do we realy need to switch fighter configs? if there was a fighter dependent sawndz loader (in the same vein as oshtoby's stage dependent song loader) would that work? how are sounds loaded? are soundbanks called one at a time? if so, does caling it again unload the previous instance? For example, P1 is maro and bank and P2 is a clone using mario's bank. are the instances of the bank separate or would it only load the banks once?

if only once, could we force it to load multiple times by tricking it into thinking it is loading a separate bank? (loads mario then thinks it is loading a different bank but actually loads mario again with the sawnd.

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« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2016, 09:44:45 AM »

Alright I did some tests, and frustratingly it seems using my method one would indeed need 4 separate PSAs (altered to load sound effects from the different soundbanks as well) I tried without doing that and sadly the sound effects just don't play.

This leaves me at an impasse since I currently don't know exactly how to do that, and it'd require it be done with every custom voice, which seems like it'd be more work than anyone's willing to really put into it. Since it'd require a large PSA overhaul.

What it would do, however, would provide us with much more voice and sound options than using bosses since characters have almost twice as many sound slots than bosses.

There doesn't seem to be another way to do it though since Brawl is so picky about sound effects...

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« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2016, 06:24:07 PM »

what about instead of 4 different PSA's or config folders, what if we did 4 different sawnds folders? alternatively, simply 4 different sawnds (39_A.sawnd, 39_B. sawnd, 39_C.sawnd, etc.).

when are .sawnds called? if they are called individually, each character could pull from it's own folder.

for example:

IF character slot 3F, THEN load sawnds from pf/sfx/3F

we run into problems though if sawnds are called simultaneously.we would still have more options as we could have multiple characters use the same soundbank, but we would have problems when two characters with the same bank were loaded. (I am guessing and hoping this isn't the case though because of the wii's limited memory)

I would imagine that you would need to add to the Replacment SoundBank Engine to do this. after all, if the rsbe code can load sawnds from a defined folder, then it should be no problem to define a new folder. the trick is inserting a trigger. each user would probably have to add in custom lines of code the same way you have to for the custom stage select code.

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« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2016, 10:02:24 PM »

Basically to clone get a new sound to load you gotta have each of these...
1. A soundbank to load
2. A Fighterconfig set to load said soundbank
3. A Fit(character).pac with the sound effects set to work with the loaded soundbank.

all soundbanks are loaded at once in the SFX folder. To get a working code I'd need to basically swap between SFX folders, Fitchar.pacs and fighterconfigs.

I've tested the SFX swapping, it works as long as another character isn't using the same soundbank, but I haven't tested swapping the fighterconfig (I found the file location in memory though so that's next on my list).

Then I'd just need to test PSA swapping

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« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2016, 05:48:26 PM »

everything loading together is unfortunate. that means we have to have all our sounds repeated in the other folders. However, this at least means that we can have, as you say,  multiple of the same clone with different sfx so long as they aren't matched against one another.

so if I understand correctly, what you have so far is a character dependent sfx folder loader.
for example: luffy and naruto over ike. you select luffy as p1 and it loads sfx folder A. Naruto as p1 calls sfx folder 2. But if both are selected, the last to be selected overrides the first

What we now need is a soundbank dependent character loader that triggers after the  previous code and is triggered by detecting that a soundbank is already called (or a specific character). To take the above example, if p1 is luffy and p2 is naruto, when naruto is selected, it checks to see if the soundbank has already been called. it has (by luffy) so naruto gets his fighter config swapped. said config is the exact same except it calls a different soundbank (for example, pit)..................

oh geeez. such a thing would get REALLY complicated REALLY fast wouldn't it?    

I don't know if we can get this perfect but what you have already may just be good enough. (though keep up the good work on the config and psa swapping as those may be of use in other ways) meanwhile I'm going to test out a crazy idea I have. if it works, we can at least minimize how often two characters conflict.  

edit: my crazy plan failed, largely due to the current limitations of brawlbox. I was going to see if I could straight up delete useless soundbanks and then create clone banks with the freed up space (in other words, delete subspace soundbanks and put in a marth2 bank. unfortunately, brawlbox does not allow you to edit smashbros_sound.brsar to quite that degree.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2016, 06:49:20 PM by Brightshadow360 » Logged

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« Reply #9 on: February 21, 2016, 11:51:49 PM »

Any progress on that code?

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« Reply #10 on: March 07, 2016, 07:46:08 AM »

Sorry it took so long but I have some bad news, apparently fighterconfigs can't be swapped, I've thrown just about every different method I could think of, folder swapping, editing the data internally after its loaded, but the game downright refuses to change the soundbank midgame, this... completely ruins any chance of my method working as infuriating as it is.

One thing I did discover, however, is I can get different soundfonts to load in the same folder by renaming the filetype for example if I wanted an extra mario voice instead of 8.sawnd I could have it load 8.saw3F (for clone 3f. This will still overwrite Mario's voice though so two characters with the same soundbank can't fight each other.

I'm at a as to how else I could do it, since expanding the soundbank list is beyond my abilities. I might have to try to dissect the BrawlEx File Patch code and see if I can tweak it, though I have my doubts for any success...


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« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2016, 10:34:40 PM »

As things stand, you can currently only have one soundbank that would apply to all cloned characters so having a code that allows for more than one is actually a HUGE step forward. After all, if your using random, how often are two characters with the same bank going to be loaded? I don't suppose you could release version 1.0 of the code could you? 

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« Reply #12 on: May 31, 2016, 10:43:03 PM »

In my experience, characters sharing the same sound file works ok until a character is used again in a match without backing out of the CSS screen.

So, one solution (for sfx-sharing characters, anyway) would be to make a code that forces the players back to the main menu or the menu right before the CSS menu.

How to do that, exactly, is another challenge entirely. =.=

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    « Reply #13 on: June 01, 2016, 03:31:07 PM »

    Really, the most elegant solution would be to turn our collective attention to breaking open smashbros_sound.brsar, and find a way to add new banks. Even if the banks added were just dummy entries that we could .sawnd into, I think that would be the best bet.

    Not only that, but if we could add new banks, it would also open up the possibility of adding in new .brstm files without a bunch of code hackery.

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    « Reply #14 on: June 01, 2016, 04:25:21 PM »

    has anyone tried looking into the sound IDs and modifying them there?

    i don't think a very direct approach would work without modifying the entire game to address sounds directly and independently of a brsar

    we'd first need to look at attacking these routes in the procedure call in a sound before any hope of adding sounds or even brstms will be possible

    Post Merge: June 01, 2016, 05:38:03 PM

    if only once, could we force it to load multiple times by tricking it into thinking it is loading a separate bank? (loads mario then thinks it is loading a different bank but actually loads mario again with the sawnd.

    that would be or mean changing the top left highlighted item on the fly multiple times, possibly having to be on a per sound call basis in my image above (or below)  as that's what dictates the bank/brstm/seq that loads or is used for that slot or ID call[spoilers]
    « Last Edit: June 01, 2016, 05:38:05 PM by Diddy Kong » Logged

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