Project RIDLEY PSA *VERSION 1.1 IS OUT*

[Aether]

Exactly why i am making it. Every other main franchise on the roster got a new rep except for Metroid. And no, i dont exactly count Zero Suit Samus as a new character. The least Sakurai could have done was give her a real moveset. No, he just made one up on the spot and gave her a whip. Her moveset should have been nothing but melee attacks with the stun pistol integrated in with the special attacks.
That reminds me to add another thing to the to-do-list. Once im done with this im making a Other M Samus AND Zero Suit Samus PSA.

[Weyard]

Sakurai's way of thinking is apparently very different from any normal sane person. Rather basing a character's moves on concepts and moves that they actually used in their game, he always chose to pull ideas out of his a$$ first, then fill in the remaining gaps with real moves. ZSS is one of the best examples of this. He himself coined the term Zero Suit Samus, because Zero Mission introduced gameplay of Samus in that suit. Then he came up with the electric whip idea....out of nowhere. Normal Samus's moveset is the exact same way. Rather than giving her a fast projectile beam as she SHOULD HAVE, he gave her a blast that is completely useless without charging. Not to mention the fact that you can't move while charging. Charge Beam has been optional in nearly every canon Metroid game. It was just a stupid idea from the very beginning.

Another Rant:

Isaac- Why use Move when he could have used a Venus psynergy move, or better yet, Judgment? It sounds to me like someone played through the first hour of Golden Sun and was amazed that you had "magic" skills that were used to progress and solve tasks outside of battle.
Luigi- After the release of Luigi's Mansion, Luigi should have been de-cloned and given a Vacuum-based moveset in the next game. Sakurai fails to do so, leaving us with another semi-clone.
Ganondorf- Ganondorf's Melee model was based off of his Ocarina of Time appearance. In OoT, he is a sorcerer. It is never mentioned anywhere in the game that he is a warrior, nor do you fight him physically in human-form. He should have had a magic-based moveset. With his B move being the reflectable ball of energy that he and Phantom Ganon use. They neglected to do so, leaving him as a clone. Then comes Brawl. TP was already out by the time Brawl was in development, so Ganondorf should have had a sword-wielding moveset to match his TP appearance. Yet it was once again neglected and he was left a clone. I find it odd that NONE of the clones from Melee, gained completely new movesets in Brawl. They had time to add in tons of useless features that no one even uses or wanted for that matter, yet couldn't find time to finish character's whom they refused/were unable to finish in Melee.
Sakurai: "So Ganondorf's gonna be in SSBM, what should we do for his moveset?"
Random guy at Hal Laboratories: "Oh lets make him have a magic-based moveset, similar to Zelda.
Other Random Guy at Hal Laboratories: "NOOO give him a sword.
Sakurai: "ok, lets give him a sword....no wait at the last minute, lets get rid of the sword and give him a bare-handed fighting style...like Captain Falcon."

On Topic:

I would also prefer not to go begging, but if it must be done, then it must be done.

It's not like we're asking for that much. The dash's animation is already finished and I've already got some psa work done for it. It doesn't work, but I'm pretty sure I have all of the necessary stuff there. I used Ike's forward B as a template and went in and changed it so it applies to charizard's things. I apparently just have something horribly wrong at some point XD. I'll just post the link to it's download again so someone might just have a look at it and tell me whats wrong if nothing else. http://www.mediafire.com/?tfe77qbpu8h2rt1


Personally, I have to say that Isaac was the single most deserving Character for Brawl, because Ridley should have been in Melee. The Golden Sun series is, to me, hands down the best rpg since Chrono Trigger and in my eyes, has still yet to be bested. There are games with a better storyline, and games with superior gameplay, but Golden Sun had so many things going for it and stuck with me.

@Aether

Other M Samus needs ZSS's downB evade jump thing of course. The rest of the B moves would probably just stay the same, excluding the Neutral B. You could just get rid of the charge, make it fire faster with no delay and do less damage.

[irishladdie727]

I'm just going to go ahead and say that Zero Suit Samus' moveset is probably one of the funnest ones to play as hands down, and replacing it would be silly.  Maybe Sakurai approaches game design with things like fun in mind instead of canon accuracy or whatever, seeing as he's a game designer and not a fanboy.  I'm all behind what you guys are doing, but I don't think that the Brawl modding community is anything more than the crazies running the asylum sometimes, especially when I see people getting all high and mighty and saying they could have made a better game than Sakurai.  The truth is, he made the game that Nintendo wanted to release and not everybody was going to be pleased with it, and there are about a million more factors that constrained every one of his decisions to put things in the game than the three (ability, time, [censored]-giving) that restrict us.  Don't make modding your "revenge" against those heartless game developers who spend their lives trying to think of new ways to entertain you, and please don't whine about Nintendo taking canon liberties with their own licensed properties.  Nintendo are and always have been gameplay first and story second and I would not have it any other way.  Just make the hacks you want and stop complaining about what was missing from a game that we've now made nearly unrecognizable.  There are more anime characters in the vault now than Nintendo ones for god's sake.  We can do whatever we want to this game.  Whining about what Sakurai did or didn't do at this point is such a worthless waste of good time and energy.  Especially when you nitpick at the numerous things Vanilla Brawl got perfectly right, such as coming up with a really fun moveset for Zero Suit Samus, rarely seen outside her suit, just like Sakurai had done before with Captain Falcon and Fox, never even controlled outside their ships before Smash 64.  He may be pulling things out of his ass, but that same ass shat THE FALCON PUNCH, which had no basis in F-Zero whatsoever.  That's one brilliant ass in my opinion.

All that said, I'll still do that vertex when I get the chance.


Edit: Also your willingness to tweak balance in favor of storyline accuracy for a new Samus moveset concens me a little bit.  Please promise me you'll try and integrate Ridley into the balance scheme.  I remove overpowered characters from my game once I discover their cheapness and it would sadden me to do that with Ridley.  We all know the Cloud PSA is crazy bull[censored].  Everybody should shoot for a PSA as well-balanced as Zero or Mewtwo.  Even Zero is a little overpowered in my opinion.

[Weyard]

I'm just going to go ahead and say that Zero Suit Samus' moveset is probably one of the funnest ones to play as hands down, and replacing it would be silly.  Maybe Sakurai approaches game design with things like fun in mind instead of canon accuracy or whatever, seeing as he's a game designer and not a fanboy.  I'm all behind what you guys are doing, but I don't think that the Brawl modding community is anything more than the crazies running the asylum sometimes, especially when I see people getting all high and mighty and saying they could have made a better game than Sakurai.  The truth is, he made the game that Nintendo wanted to release and not everybody was going to be pleased with it, and there are about a million more factors that constrained every one of his decisions to put things in the game than the three (ability, time, [censored]-giving) that restrict us.  Don't make modding your "revenge" against those heartless game developers who spend their lives trying to think of new ways to entertain you, and please don't whine about Nintendo taking canon liberties with their own licensed properties.  Nintendo are and always have been gameplay first and story second and I would not have it any other way.  Just make the hacks you want and stop complaining about what was missing from a game that we've now made nearly unrecognizable.  There are more anime characters in the vault now than Nintendo ones for god's sake.  We can do whatever we want to this game.  Whining about what Sakurai did or didn't do at this point is such a worthless waste of good time and energy.  Especially when you nitpick at the numerous things Vanilla Brawl got perfectly right, such as coming up with a really fun moveset for Zero Suit Samus, rarely seen outside her suit, just like Sakurai had done before with Captain Falcon and Fox, never even controlled outside their ships before Smash 64.  He may be pulling things out of his ass, but that same ass shat THE FALCON PUNCH, which had no basis in F-Zero whatsoever.  That's one brilliant ass in my opinion.

All that said, I'll still do that vertex when I get the chance.


Edit: Also your willingness to tweak balance in favor of storyline accuracy for a new Samus moveset concens me a little bit.  Please promise me you'll try and integrate Ridley into the balance scheme.  I remove overpowered characters from my game once I discover their cheapness and it would sadden me to do that with Ridley.  We all know the Cloud PSA is crazy bull[censored].  Everybody should shoot for a PSA as well-balanced as Zero or Mewtwo.  Even Zero is a little overpowered in my opinion.

I found Sonic's moveset to be unique and fun to play as, yet we have more shadow PSA's (finished and in process) than we have Landmasters in Brawl. XD


Nintendo might not have followed their canon source material, but we can. And we feel that character's will turn out better if they follow the source material, despite what history has shown (cap falcon/fox for example)

-

My look on the entire series in response:

The Original Smash Bros was creative and every single idea in it, aside from Samus's neutral B, were great and expanded on the canon-design of those characters. In Fox's case, the moveset that Sakurai developed for him was expanded on and certain elements of it can be seen in Star Fox Adventures in his Staff-weilding moveset. SSB kept true to those characters while giving them options and actual playability that they didn't have in their original games. Captain Falcon and Fox were very well-done. Their movesets fit them perfectly.  Melee was fine. I was disappointed that some percentage of the roster were just clones of other characters, but I dealt with it.
Melee was still a multiplayer-based game. I did not play competitively through wavedashing, yet I played the game as competitively as possible without exploiting glitches. After all was said and done, I greatly enjoyed Melee. I always thought that if they made a new SSB, it would fix those clones, since they would probably focus on them from the beginning and make a point to give them new movesets. The realization that Brawl did not do this was my main disappointment with it. Since the clones have carried on through 2 games, I don't see them getting new movesets in future SSB games either.

I don't see why, given the resources/time/knowledge at Nintendo's disposal, that they would have to do these things. Brawl was delayed all those times, yet we still ended up with a couple of clones/semi-clones. Then they added all of those useless features which without a doubt took up a great deal of their development time. It seems as though they added things just to take one's attention away from gameplay elements. Instead of enjoying the multiplayer gameplay that made Melee so popular, one can now spend hours playing through a kirby-styled sidescroller where button mashing is all that's really required, or spend hours playing 10 second demo's of old games, or reading through a chronicle of all of the games that were somehow represented in Brawl. They took the focus off of Gameplay and placed it on casual features.

I suppose Nintendo's recent trend toward "casual gaming" is more to blame than Sakurai. It's not that I hate Sakurai or think I could have done better, because I most definitely couldn't have. It's just that among the great things he has done with the SSB series, he has also made some pretty stupid decisions and I like to talk about them XD. Notice how I put my rants in spoiler tags? When I get started thinking about the stupid things he has done, I just tend to rant a little. I can't help it DX.

and please don't whine about Nintendo taking canon liberties

By hacking and producing fan projects, we are all taking huge steaming dumps on Nintendo's copyrights all the time so that's not really a valid arguement XD.

Balancing has been the number 1 issue with Ridley since the beginning. When coming up with his potential moveset, several things were trashed because they would have been Metaknight-level broken or worse, while others were just far too hard for either of us to do in psa. I don't see the point of playing as character's who 1-hit everything and would never purposefully make one. We wanted him to have fast, with many no knockback comboing attacks like Metaknight, that would hit 3-5 times then let the opponent DI out of it. After we got started though, his moveset started getting simpler and simpler to fit what we would be able to do in psa. People have brought us ideas that far surpass what we were able to do in psa, so that's why we're still waiting on other people to do certain moves for us.

He's going to be made faster. I don't know why Aether made him so slow in the first place. One would think that when messing with attributes to see what they did, you would add to them instead of lowering them. As he is made faster, even more tweaking is going to have to be done so his newly added speed doesn't make anything extremely spammable and broke.

Right now, his only attack's that are somewhat broken are his forwardAerial (and If I'm not mistaken, Aether has already put some delay on it so it can't be spammed), his forward smash (it still has far too much knockback when sweetspotted), and his downAir (due to it's spammability). These will all be corrected at some point.

The fireballs can wall an opponent out of the screen if used correctly (or should I say incorrectly), but unless Aether finds a way to fix the Double fireball effect of it, I don't think that's going to be changed.

I said earlier that once he is finished I'll be making a list of his match-ups. If he was meant to be broken, this would be pointless as he probably wouldn't have any bad match-ups period.

And about the ZSS and Samus moveset tweaks, just because he's going to change their movesets doesn't mean that it's going to effect the balancing. If Samus's charge beam was made a little more spammable and lost the knockback of a Fully charged blast, I don't think it would affect her match-ups in the long run. She would be losing a potential killmove, but gaining a new damaging move.  If ZSS used kick's or something instead of the whip, I don't think it would affect her match-ups either. In ZSS's case, the changes are probably going to just be visual from what he's told me. Aether just doesn't like it that Sakurai made up the whip thing to seemingly fit some random criteria he had for a whip-user. However Samus could use a new/altered moveset. The only other Samus psa that I know of is Dark Samus's. Variation is always good in my opinion. If you get bored with one moveset, you can just swap a different fitmotion and pac into the folder and your ready to go. That's one of the great things about Brawl Hacking now.

[Aether]

bump

[irishladdie727]

I'm not going to quote your post Weyard because it's enormous, but it put me at ease.  I just kind of vented my frustration with the Hacking community at large on you guys.  At least we can agree that the Anime and Shadow stuff needs to go bye bye.  Idk though, maybe I'm just a purist, and granted I do use Brawl + so I barely remember what the old Brawl actually felt like, but I've always been hesitant to meddle with the original 35 characters.

[Aether]

I play balanced brawl, and am (and always have been) sick of normal brawl. Sakurai ruined all that melee was and all that brawl could have been. If not adding the most deserving characters wasnt bad enough, he greatly favored his own game even making his favorite creation, the "Best" Character. And no, im not satisfied with that. I think that every character should be balanced, which my Ridley will be. This is still in the early stages. Once the moveset is completely finished i can tweak his damage and knockback to make him balanced.

If anything, the reason i starting hacking was to get these ideas out to Nintendo and the world and show them where they went wrong. They need to know that the very man directing the game is the one who has lead to thousands of fans hating it. I just wish that they would let somebody else make the next one. Maybe let Shigeru Miyamoto help Sakurai with it. Atleast he will spread the favoritism over a few more deserving series (Mario, Zelda, Metroid).

[Fliptocat]

For the dash: Do you have a line of code in "other" called 18000100-06? That caused problems for me when I was working with PSA, but I'm not certain it'll fix yours.

[Weyard]

For the dash: Do you have a line of code in "other" called 18000100-06? That caused problems for me when I was working with PSA, but I'm not certain it'll fix yours.

No idea. I'd have to redownload it to check. My computer's been rebooted since I started on that so I lost it.

So what did you do with that code, just delete it to fix the problem?

I took all of the information from Ike's forward B Special Tab, replaced all of the parts that mentioned Ike's subactions and related them to the correct ones for Charizard. Then took the Main and Other from Ike's and changed what I thought was appropriate there.

[Weyard]

Bump

[Fliptocat]

^Yeah, it just needs to be deleted. I would've tried it myself, but mediafire wasn't working.

EDIT: forgot to mention this, but you could try the add/remove momentum command.

[Weyard]

^Yeah, it just needs to be deleted. I would've tried it myself, but mediafire wasn't working.

EDIT: forgot to mention this, but you could try the add/remove momentum command.

I'm working on a couple of other projects right now, but as soon as I get back into this, I'll definitely try that momentum command. I think I might have moved his model while leaving his transN on the neutral position. If that's the case, that could explain it. Usually the TransN has to be moved as well if I'm not mistaken.

[Fliptocat]

^I've messed with the TransN before so yeah, that's likely the problem. Well, good luck.

[zetsame]

bump.

[Aether]

i think im just going to just get rid of the false projectile air fireball and replace it with a throw N fireball like the ground one. It doesnt cause the double fireball problem i think. Either way it looks like im going to be updating again before anybody helps us : /
So, for changes to expect next update:
-Edited air fireball
-Weakened ground fireball
-Non spammable forward aerial
-lower knockback resistance/defense for balancing
-more air mobility and less weight