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Author Topic: I admit it, I need to know the basics of Brawl Hacking  (Read 4758 times)
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the_randomizer
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    « on: February 09, 2012, 07:14:35 PM »


    So, it's blindingly obvious that I need to read many tutorials about using BrawlBox, 3DS Max and other editors if I'm to do the very thing I wish to do.  Yes, I'm very new at this, and while I have some experiencing hacking the the files in the ISO (extracting it with Dolphin, changing the texture and brstm files, as well as spending several hours creating custom loops in many soundtracks), hacking the vertices/models themselves is something I wish to know more about.  Recompiling the ISO image with the altered files is not an issue, so, I do have some (limited) experience hacking, but I want to learn more.

    I know that there are numerous tutorials

    ModSet http://forums.kc-mm.com/index.php?topic=16330.0
    Other relevant tutorials - http://forums.kc-mm.com/index.php?topic=10921.0

    To be honest, even though I'm overwhelmed by the number of guides out there, where I need to begin and so on, I'm more than willing to learn what it takes.

    What I want to accomplish from learning from the hacking tutorials:

    - How to properly locate bones in the FitMotionPac files using BrawlBox*
    - How to properly edit said bones, hex values and so on using WindHex32 and change the values*
    - How to eventually learn how to import models or at least alter the textures on characters


    *More specifically, there are two characters with whom I wish to alter bones with; the ThrowN bown in the FirMotionPac file. The reason being is I need the experience, as the closest tutorial I've seen isn't quite what I'm looking for (as it mentions altering the graphic without altering the throw bones - http://forums.kc-mm.com/index.php?topic=37829.0 ) What I'm looking for are tutorials on the actual locating AND editing
    of this bone, so that it's not offset when grabbing an item and/or opponent. The characters are Wolf and the recently released Krystal over Fox mod.

    I've already posted a couple of other threads similar to this, but every time I do, it just gets tossed aside like a bill going through Congress to get defeated.  Please, someone, I'm willing to do what it takes, I just need to be pointed in the right direction!
    « Last Edit: February 09, 2012, 07:16:35 PM by the_randomizer » Logged

    Spex130
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    « Reply #1 on: February 09, 2012, 08:36:01 PM »


    Oh man. That was beautiful. Most of the "I'm new at this" things I've seen forgot how punctuation and capitalization worked. So, lets see what I can help with, here.

    What I want to accomplish from learning from the hacking tutorials:

    - How to properly locate bones in the FitMotionPac files using BrawlBox*
    - How to properly edit said bones, hex values and so on using WindHex32 and change the values*
    - How to eventually learn how to import models or at least alter the textures on characters

    *More specifically, there are two characters with whom I wish to alter bones with; the ThrowN bown in the FirMotionPac file. The reason being is I need the experience, as the closest tutorial I've seen isn't quite what I'm looking for (as it mentions altering the graphic without altering the throw bones - http://forums.kc-mm.com/index.php?topic=37829.0 ) What I'm looking for are tutorials on the actual locating AND editing
    of this bone, so that it's not offset when grabbing an item and/or opponent. The characters are Wolf and the recently released Krystal over Fox mod.


    So. I can't really direct you towards many guides, but I'll tell you what I know.

    #1) Bones aren't found in the fit(Character)MotionEtc.pac. Bones are found in the Fit(Char)##.pac and .pcs files. What FitMotions contain are A) Animations, and B) various articles called upon in combat. (I.E. Ness' Yoyo.)

    #2) I don't quite know what you mean by "edit" bones. There are a lot of things you can do to the TransN, here. You might want to be a lot more specific with what you want to do.

    #3) Altering textures is the easiest part. Making them look good is more on the artist's skills, but just editing them is easy. Tell me if you want to know more.

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    the_randomizer
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    « Reply #2 on: February 10, 2012, 09:22:44 AM »


    (Warning, this may be TL:DR for some!) Yeah, sorry about the confusion on the thread name, but I try to make an effort to use REAL English and punctuation almost all of the time, as I absolutely despise heavily abbreviated words, no capitalization and so on (especially confusing "you're" and "your" *shudder*)!  But anyway, so, I eventually discovered what I was really looking for, by watching some youtube videos.  It seems that the file I really needed was the FitMotionPac (or was it called the MotionPacEtc...something to that effect, but it's not the FitChar0x, though I do use it as a base).  

    What I did was, I opened up BrawlBox,  chose a FitChar0x.pac (any character's 0x.pac file, really, as a base) file, got to the 3D model tab, then pressed Crtl+P for the preview, and after I got the 3D modeller opened, I then loaded the MotionPacEtc as an external file (where the moveset animations are located).  From there, I started scrolling down the list of animations and located the very thing I wanted to change for months, "Catch Wait".  

    To make sure it was the very thing I was looking for, I pressed "loop" and played the animation over and over again, and I then said to myself, "Yep! This is what I've been looking for!"  See, originally, I thought it was the ThrowN bone for some noobish reason, but much to my joy, it was the animation itself.  Yes, which means that if I change the X, Y and Z axises on the hand/arm, I have to do that for every single frame (in this case, most "Catch Wait" animations are around 31 on frames).

    That's where BrawlBox comes in handy, you can select where the bones' axis changed, click "copy" then go to the next frame and then click "paste".  While I managed to do this to many characters (such as Falco, Peach, King Dedede, Fox, etc), there are some problems that I've encountered.  For testing, I use Dolphin simply because it's infinitely more convenient in my opinion (and loading times are very short in comparison), but I still need to recompile the ISO image every time I add new FitMotionEtc files to the "fighter" folder.  A small setback, but not that big of a deal. Oddly enough, the changes I made to these characters' animations never crashed the emulator once.

    So anyways, even though I changed about ten characters' Catch Wait X, Y, Z axises for every animation frame, only about half of them actually show up in the game, the other half look as though no changes were ever made.  See this is confusing me, am I even doing this right?  I'm not so much concerned about the ThrowN bone as I am the Catch Wait animation to change how foes are grasped (a little pet peeve, sort of an OCD thing I have).
    Some of the animations look very unnatural to me.

    Take Wolf for example, when he grabs an opponent, the enemy is just below his claws, looking very unnatural. If anything, I hope to change it so Wolf's hand is actually wrapped around the enemy, or at least give the impression that Wolf is actually holding the enemy in question.  But, no matter what points on the axises I change, it still doesn't look right, heck, again, I don't even know if this is right way to do it.  If it isn't, please let me know.  One last thing, while I adjust these animations' axises, is there any way to make sure they actually connect to the opponent before I add them to the ISO, or will I need to keep playing around with the 3D until I get it right?
    « Last Edit: February 10, 2012, 09:25:50 AM by the_randomizer » Logged

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    « Reply #3 on: February 10, 2012, 10:03:32 AM »


    Well, as far as the Catch animations go, most of the editing you'll do is on the ThrowN.

    You see, the ThrowN's "name" is kind of misleading. It's actually used as the Anchor point for the character to be connected to so they can be "Thrown." If you want to edit where the character is held, move the ThrowN to a different spot.

    Also, the characters are ALWAYS going to be connected to the ThrowN. You don't need to worry about that, UNLESS bones have been added to the character on a bone parented before the ThrowN. Each character has a specific number which will act as its ThrowN, so if bones are added, Bone number X is still going to be the ThrowN, even if it's an elbow or something.

    When you say change the Axis, did you MOVE the bone or ROTATE the bone, and was the bone you moved the ThrowN?
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    « Reply #4 on: February 10, 2012, 10:15:01 AM »


    No, the bones I changed (mostly around the hand/fingers) were not moved to ThrowN, but I probably should have done so.  So to sum up what you said, I alter ThrowN in order for the characters who are being grabbed to attach to the hand?  And I also rotated the axises on some of the hands, like Falco for example. Normally, his hand points up in a tight clamp-like position, but what I did was tilt it to the side, so the grab animation resembles more like someone holding a soda cup.  I probably shouldn't have done that, huh?  Do I just alter the ThrowN bone, or do I need to do more than just that?  And once I do, how will I know if it will actually connect to the opponent in question?

    I apologize for sounding like a noob, but I really want to learn more about this.  I'll try to summarize just what I want to do.  Okay, so some of the ThrowN animations look really weird on some characters, making the connecting opponents either offset, or not quite engulfed in the grabbing hand.  This is what I want to change, so that the grab actually connects to the opponent.  I will need to change the pivot/rotations on some of the hands to the side to make them look better (in my opinion anyway).  Yep, that's it in a nutshell.
    « Last Edit: February 10, 2012, 10:18:49 AM by the_randomizer » Logged

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    « Reply #5 on: February 10, 2012, 01:09:49 PM »


    So, pretty much it's like this. The only bone that matters at all in a throw subaction is the ThrowN. Imagine that the ThrowN bone is where the opponent will be. Heck, he could be floating 20 feet away, but that's where the opponent will be held. You could dance in circles around the ThrowN, and that's what would happen in game.

    What you want to do, is after you've edited the animations, simply move the ThrowN where you'd imagine their neck would be, or something similar.
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    « Reply #6 on: February 10, 2012, 04:03:04 PM »


    Oh, really, that's it?! Huh, for some reason I'd thought it would be much more complicated than that. So to recap, I edit the hand position (animation) then I simply drag the ThrowN bone to the proximity of the character making the grab/catch?  Wow. Thanks for clearing up the confusion!  Will experiment and report back!  Grin  Oh, and regarding the actual axis changing of the characters' hands, why do some changes I make to the fingers/rotation show up in Dolphin, while others I edit don't?  Now, to figure out how to actually move the bone....

    Here's a video of what it is I'm trying to do -
    <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1HHu7A6VfI" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1HHu7A6VfI</a>


    Can't figure out how to shift bones around yet.



    Edit 5:38! Wait a minute! I think I figured it out, I use the X, Y and Z values in the Translation boxes to move ThrowN, right!?
    « Last Edit: February 10, 2012, 05:39:11 PM by the_randomizer » Logged

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    « Reply #7 on: February 10, 2012, 08:14:32 PM »


    Yes. You are correct! That's how you move bones!

    As for some edits working and others not....

    I don't know. Sometimes the feet will ignore animations, but I never knew about the hands.
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    « Reply #8 on: February 10, 2012, 09:16:12 PM »


    Bowser is a good example of the ones that don't work despite making physical changes to his hands/claws. I could always send the .pac file in question if need be. One thing's for certain, getting just the right position for the bone can be mighty tedious, but, that's how I learn though. Good ol' trial and error.
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    « Reply #9 on: February 10, 2012, 10:08:12 PM »


    Yeah, I can't really help you with Bowser animation. I've never messed with his.

    Good luck though!
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    « Reply #10 on: February 10, 2012, 11:21:38 PM »


    Thanks. I think I'm finally getting somewhere in the hacking scene!
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    « Reply #11 on: February 10, 2012, 11:28:10 PM »


    Any other questions?
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    « Reply #12 on: February 11, 2012, 01:01:06 AM »


    Should I place the questions I had about those vertex mods that didn't load properly (like Bowser, Sheik, etc) in another forums (like the Animation one?  That problem has me baffled, but I managed to alter the FitMotionETC ThrowN positions (to my liking) for Falco, Wolf, Fox, Dedede, MetaKnight, and a few others, but like all things, there's always room for improvement and still many things I need to learn.  I do have two mre question about the actual lining up of the ThrowN bone. Now, when I view the model in BrawlBox, where that bone is located looks off (or rather, looks way too offset) when lining it up with the characters' hand bones.  Do you have any tips/hints to more effectively lining up the ThrowN bone with hands?  And also, with animation, are there any more effective ways to animate new changes without tediously pasting the positions in every frame?
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    « Reply #13 on: February 11, 2012, 01:18:54 AM »


    Hmm. Well, about the forum, I suppose posting your question in Animation Help would be good. Getting your questions is really a matter of luck.

    Um. About moving the bones, you can use your keyboard. And if it doesn't match up, pay attention where it's messing up in-game so you can fix it the next time.

    Also, there's something called interpolation, I think? It means you don't have to enter a number in for EVERY SINGLE FRAME.

    Just put something in one frame, then X frames later, put something else. Brawlbox will do all the rest of the work for you. Mostly. It has this cool boomerang rebound effect, but it sometimes gets in the way.

    Edit: Now that I think about it, this is actually in the wrong section altogether, I think. Oh well! Whatever!
    « Last Edit: February 11, 2012, 01:20:31 AM by Spex130 » Logged


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    « Reply #14 on: February 11, 2012, 08:32:10 AM »


    Oops.  Yeah, I really should have payed attention to where I posted this in the first place. My bad!
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