Haloedhero's Projects: Finally on the Project: M Team

[xZedkiel]

Ok, I've done a load of testing and here's what I think of it:

It's a mixed bag.  However, the flaws of him are mainly due to the fact that this is an early release.  For the most part, I really lesbians love it.  I'll probably start by analysing each move individually first, then give a more general summary:

Basic Moves

- Wait animation works great and looks great.  Nothing really to say about it.

- I definitely think the Walking and Running animations would suit best as the ones from the game.  I think custom animations would suit them better.  I'll even make the running animation for you as a gift if you want

- Jumping animations and falling animations definitely work well.  His fall speed is strange though.  I'm not sure if this was just me, but it seemed that he fell much faster from the 1st jump than from the 2nd.  Also, his wall jump is hilariously small XD  (I was using the Universal Walljump code)

- Not fussed about other animations.  They don't look out of place or anything.


Attacks

AAA combo - Despite using this against CPUs, it's obvious that it is quite possible to DI out of.  However, if your opponent is quite inexperienced or if they are a CPU, they will rarely DI out of it.  The problem is, when this is the case it's VERY abusable.  There were a number of instances where I found I was able to rack up between about 30-50% on the CPU just by holding A.  My suggestion is that make the forward knockback hit have a slightly higher knockback than the backwards knockback hit.  That way, you can still deal decent damage, but it doesn't keep the foe trapped there constantly.  Also, methinks the kick needs a sound effect

F Tilt - By the looks of it, it's basically Ness' F Tilt.  It serves almost identical purpose and function too.  Not too sure what to do with this.  It's just a generally well rounded move and it works.  Oh yeah, and if you listen closely you can still hear the PK sound effect that Lucas' old F Tilt made XD

U Tilt - Needs less base knockback and a bit more knockback growth.  Even at 0% you can only really do it once or twice.  Considering it only does 5% (Mario's U Tilt for example, serves a similar purpose but is easier to combo with and does 7%), I think it needs a little buff.

D Tilt - Basically Lucas' but with less speed and more knockback.  I think this should hit foes at a lower angle than it currently does.  I think it would be most useful if it was more like BBrawl Sonic's D Tilt (in knockback and trajectory).

Dash Attack - Very nicely weighted move.  I actually don't think this needs any changing.  It's fast and powerful, but balanced because it lacks reach and it's punishable


F Smash - Out of his three smashes, this one was by far the least useful.  Because of the angle of the kick, it can literally just go over the heads of some smaller foes like Kirby, Pikachu and Olimar.  It's not that fast, not that strong, the reach isn't amazing and it's very punishable.  This move needs a buff in all areas.  The main things I think would be to make the hitboxes larger and give it more knockback to make it better as a killing move (since at the moment it's not really good for anything).  However, the animation looks awesome.  I actually like how he suspends the kick, and the charging animation works beautifully.

U Smash - His strongest smash obviously, and the one I found overall most useful.  Because of its fairly low base knockback, I found myself able to juggle with it at low %.  However, I think this should actually be changed.  It should primarily be a killing move (somewhat like Fox's U Smash).  The knockback growth should be lowered a bit, and the base knockback increased.  I still love this move though.  I frequently find myself saying SHORYUKEN when connecting it XD

D Smash - This is basically the F Smash, but better in literally every way except range.  It has about the same knockback, but and easier to land hitbox that lasts longer and comes out significantly faster.  I say either keep this as it is OR make it a multi-hit attack, with the last hit dealing the high knockback.


N Air - Love this move.  There's something so lovable about it.  The way it makes a Koopa Shell noise upon hitting an enemy is rather charming.  The main thing I really love about it though, is the little bounce it has.  It actually allows it to be a pretty good horizontal recovery move with good timing and execution.  I think the move should hit the foe slightly more upwards though rather than a generic angle.  The knockback should still be quite weak though.  Overall very nice move.

F Air - It works and it works great.  Probably Scott's best gimping tool.  However, it has poor hitstun and low % because of it's low base knockback.  As a result of this low base knockback, the move is easily punished EVEN WHEN YOU HIT IT @.@ Again, I feel it should be increased a bit more.   Also, I think it should do a little more damage too.  Maybe 11%

B Air - This shares the same problem as the F Air in the fact that it's easily punished even upon landing the hit.  Not to mention that it doesn't function as a good killing or even a very good gimping tool though.  I think the base knockback should be increased quite a lot here, but the knockback growth should be pretty low so that it still remains a non killing move.  However, the move represents a move in the moveset excellently.  The animation is nice and crisp.

U Air - Same as Lucas', but with coins :3  I actually think this should stay the same.  It works very well and is one of his better aerials when it comes to power since it's not so easily punished.

D Air - Love this move.  The animation is spot on and for the most part it's nicely balanced.  I particularly like how he bounces off the foe when you land the sweetspot on an airborne opponent.  However, I think it could use a bit more power on pretty much every hitbox, especially the sweetspot.  Considering it's basically a high risk move (if you miss the sweetspot whilst trying to edgeguard with it, you die).  


Specials

Neutral B - LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOV E THIS MOVE!!  And I love you for making it!  There's just something so awesome and involving about it.  Just watching Scott on screen strumming away whilst I mash the button.  It makes me feel as though I'm actually playing the bass, despite the fact it's just me mashing B.  The move just immerses you in a way I've never even seen before in a PSA.  There's something almost magical about it.

But enough about that.  I find it quite a hard move to critique well.  I think the start-up is a tad too slow, and the hitboxes need to last a bit longer (just make it so the Terminate Collisions occur after a later time period because at the moment each strum terminates very quickly).  I also think the hitboxes should be larger.  It's rather deceptive at the moment.  The hitbox is about half the size of the graphic.  As far as actual trapping concerns go, it's fine since you can DI downwards and tech backwards to escape.  Though maybe if the hitboxes are going to be bigger, the ability to DI out of the move.

However, the main thing I want to suggest is that if the big finish hit (aka the one that sends the foe flying a far distance) connects, the move should just end there.  I found it to be a rather spammable edgeguarding move when I got it up to max strum.  I could just keep mashing B, and they would have a lot of trouble getting back on stage.  In exchange for this, I think this last hit should also do more damage.  Maybe 6% or something.  It IS the largest strum after all XD


Side B - This move has quite a few problems.  The main ones being it starts too slow and retains no momentum at the end, making it very punishable.  It's also very irritating to use in the air because his momentum doesn't stop until actually throws the punch.  This makes recovering with it a pain in the ass because it's extremely difficult to line yourself up with the ledge.  Furthermore, because of how he just stops right in his tracks at the end of the attack instead of retaining a bit of momentum, it makes the move feel jerky and it makes it rather difficult to follow up (since unlike, say, Ike's Side B it has no kill potential).  Not really sure what to suggest for this tough.  It's just hard to use.

Up B - Gosh this move is also a pain to recover with.  It shares the same problem my Spider-Man's Up B did in earlier versions in the fact that you can't change direction when you initiate it.  It's even worse for Scott because he has a fast fall speed and no other forms of vertical recovery.  The hitbox is also very difficult to land, and very unrewarding.  I'm not really too sure about this move as a whole.  I really liked that idea you had before of the random Up Bs from characters in the cast.  I think you should do that, but to make it feel a bit more unique for Scott, he could still use that beam sword (or another sword) no matter which Up B he does.

Down B - I also LOVE this move.  Always have and always will do.  I don't think you need to do anything with this except maybe give it a bit more endlag and give a better indicator of when exactly the countering frames are.  A clicking sound effect and a little flash would do.  I also wouldn't say this is one of his primary killing moves, since it depends largely on what move you counter.  I will say though, it is VERY satisfying countering a Donkey Punch, Falcon Punch or a Warlock Punch with this.  Also, I really, REALLY like how there's the coin effect when you land the punch and depending on how strong the move was, there are more or less coins.  Very clever indeed.

Final Smash - Umm....he doesn't have one yet.  I can't wait to see what ideas you have for it though ^^


Summary

Overall, Scott is very, VERY fun to play.  He's got a few balance issues (for the most part, he's underpowered I think) but he's brimming with a lot of charm and unique flair.  Excellent work haloedhero!  I'll be eagerly awaiting when you make the next update.  I hope my comments were helpful and I'll definitely make a blog feature for this when it's done

Wow... Sdoom pretty much covered it all... I literally agree with everything he said.
Three things then...

You should make it easier to rock out... my finger hurts from mashing B so hard just to get him to maximum rockage.

I almost think you should change Side Special completely... the move is just so boring compared to the rest of the moveset.... but that's just me.

For his Final Smash you know what you've got to do right? THE POWER OF SELF RESPECT!
Somehow include the beam sword like with Up Special (Power of Love?). Make it work like Marths maybe? Or Ikes if you can where if the first hit lands then he goes into a sword combo frenzy.

These plus your Up Special ideas :3 They pretty much covered everything.

[SiLeNtDo0m]

Present for you  It's a new running animation I made for you that's more representative of this:



Here's the link.  It only includes the FitLucasMotionEtc.pac (and literally, all I changed was the run):

http://www.mediafire.com/?5zcn6rpwm4y5mz7

As for Sdoom's up special suggestions, I'm probably going to keep the current one, as the whole level up sword thing is pretty iconic to Scott, being that he took that longsword proficiency... But I'm going to change the angle back to what it was before I put out the test build, which made it much more of a "side spike", only harder to land and riskier than his F air.

Fair enough.  Though could you make it a better recovery move at least please?  It's really hard to use at the moment because you don't retain any momentum and you can't turn at the start.

[HaloedHero]

Present for you  It's a new running animation I made for you that's more representative of this:



Here's the link.  It only includes the FitLucasMotionEtc.pac (and literally, all I changed was the run):

http://www.mediafire.com/?5zcn6rpwm4y5mz7

Fair enough.  Though could you make it a better recovery move at least please?  It's really hard to use at the moment because you don't retain any momentum and you can't turn at the start.

1. Thanks for the animation. It was something I wanted to do, but wasn't high on my priority list. I appreciate the help.

2. lol, stupid Internet, I had actually typed that I was going to give it the ability to reverse, but something crapped out and I had to rewrite my post. Must have forgotten it on the second try.

[HaloedHero]

OK, so, this is a little unrelated to Scott Pilgrim, but during a testing session, I was checking to see if PK starstorm was broken, and I noticed that the slight time slow it has didn't seem to end. It was almost imperceptible, but they were slightly slower for a loooooong time. However, the only character this happened against was Ice Climbers.

The crazy thing is, I loaded the game regularly, no codes or anything, and tested this again with Marth vs. the Ice Climbers, because his time slow is much more severe, and they were STILL stuck in the slowdown long after his final smash was over! It only happens to the Ice Climbers as far as I can tell. Has anyone else seen this? Does it happen on anyone else's Wii? (Note: With Marth, I purposefully missed with the attack.)

Edit: Oh, I did have something real to say. Sdoom's run animation has been integrated with the dash and turnrun. I may tweak the animation a little, but it looks great. Thanks again, Sdoom.

[SiLeNtDo0m]

No probs, glad you liked it   And I'll look out for this glitch.  It never occurred with me, but then again I rarely used the Smash Ball, and I almost never face IC

[Mansta8]

What did you do to get rid of the other waiting animations? I'm making a personal OP version and I need to see them in game.

[HaloedHero]

I did two things. First, I set wait1 to be a loop in PSA. As far as I can tell, waits aren't standard loops. It's likely that they're programmed to randomly select one of the three at animation end. So, setting the animation to loop causes that not to happen. Also, to save filespace, I believe I cut them down to 1 frame and deleted all keyframes, so... basically, if they played, he'd just look like a litte ball for 1 frame.

[HaloedHero]

Ok, so this project is all about fanservice, because Scott Pilgrim is all about fanservice, so I'm seriously considering taking advice to change the up b to my original idea of multiple iconic up specials. So seriously, in fact, that it's almost done, but I wanted to hear from the testers whether they'd like a reversible version of the original up special or the new up special, which offers button presses to choose between Mario's up special, Link's, and Samus's, on the fly, all nearly exactly replicated for Scott.

So go ahead, tell me what you guys want.

[AnImAiNe]

i like the input idea

[Tasty Pumpkin Clock]

same

[The Main Event]

I like the new up special idea. Gives more of a variety and makes the character THAT much more interesting.

[HaloedHero]

So be it. New test build coming asap. The new down tilt is awesome. Most of what's left to do is taunts and such and balancing existing moves. Shouldn't take long.

[SonicBrawler]

TOTALLY EPIC! and the counter move is PURE AWESOMENESS!

[Kumari sai]

ok finally back with some feedback, sorry if i say something thats already been said

the AAA combo- i think this needs to have something wheres its not just a continuous barrage of punches, kind of like fox's or captain falcon's where you have to repetitively tap the a button
Tilts- i see nothing wrong with these
dash attack- i really think the side special should be the dash attack, just an opinion, the dash attack has just a bit too much end lag, which makes it hard to combo with
neutral b- love it, problem with it though is that it has alot of endlag when you get up alot of speed, links boomerang knocked me off the stage because i couldn't react in time, it would be nice if you could shield or roll out of it
side b- this move is fine just seems more like a dash attack, also you should only be able to use this once in the air, or else its too good for recovering
down b-  no complaints
up b-  *left out for already known reasons*
neutral aerial- this move has a bit of glitches, a little animation glitch when used repetitively and landing, and it can be used to float in the air which looks kinda awkward (the floating was probably on purpose, i dont know)
other aerials- all good
smash attacks- i dont see anything wrong with them

thanks for letting me test, again sorry im a little late with feedback

[HaloedHero]

ok finally back with some feedback, sorry if i say something thats already been said

the AAA combo- i think this needs to have something wheres its not just a continuous barrage of punches, kind of like fox's or captain falcon's where you have to repetitively tap the a button
Tilts- i see nothing wrong with these
dash attack- i really think the side special should be the dash attack, just an opinion, the dash attack has just a bit too much end lag, which makes it hard to combo with
neutral b- love it, problem with it though is that it has alot of endlag when you get up alot of speed, links boomerang knocked me off the stage because i couldn't react in time, it would be nice if you could shield or roll out of it
side b- this move is fine just seems more like a dash attack, also you should only be able to use this once in the air, or else its too good for recovering
down b-  no complaints
up b-  *left out for already known reasons*
neutral aerial- this move has a bit of glitches, a little animation glitch when used repetitively and landing, and it can be used to float in the air which looks kinda awkward (the floating was probably on purpose, i dont know)
other aerials- all good
smash attacks- i dont see anything wrong with them

thanks for letting me test, again sorry im a little late with feedback

No problem! Thanks for the feedback. I really think everyone's going to love the next build. I just hope I can get it done sooner rather than later.