A Bloody Canadian's PSA Thread - Shinda Remake

[ABloodyCanadian]

Another Poll. I'll use the poll feature to get feedback on the PSA, and to help out with balancing. Though it would be nice to explain your reasons.

Onto a different Topic, Shinda's character development grew a little, and I have confirmed that a new weapon of hers will be a whip. I'll try to use this over the moves that has her calling paper, as well as use this for her grab since her down throw could be considered a bit overpowered in terms of damage. Supposedly, Shinda should have 1 more weapon but I haven't decided on that yet.

[Akeno/Archer]

I would say too short for the machine gun because it's not really a killing move and it should hit farther...
But the handgun one is fine... If it was longer, it would be OP

[JamietheAuraUser]

The machine gun version's Neutral Special would be OP with its current endlag if the range was any greater. Though, it could use a bit more range, especially the aerial version. Right now, GSS has a terrible time trying to get the Smash Ball.

[ABloodyCanadian]

You seem to base this off casual play. It's not bad I guess, but I would like some feedback on competitive play.

[JamietheAuraUser]

Competitive feedback? Well, I can say that GSS's playstyle encourages constant attacking, at least when using her machine gun. If you stop, you'll get whacked. If you miss, you'll get whacked. Fortunately, hitting isn't that hard. When playing GSS, I have the highest hit percentage of any character I play as, frequently around 65-75%. (Most characters I get less than 50%, sometimes as low as 30%.)

My personal favourite chain with GSS when using her Machine Gun is: Up Tilt > Down Aerial > Down Smash > Forward Smash > Neutral Special. Unfortunately, with its shortish range Neutral Special adds only 2 or 3% damage when used at the end like that.

And of course, I realise that that chain is very escapable in multiple places, especially by characters with good jump height and smallish hurtboxes. (AKA not KJP's Dark Lord Ganon, who is my primary target with GSS.) However, the CPU opponent frequently tries to jump out of Down Smash > Forward Smash, only for the edge of Forward Smash to drag him back in. I haven't had a chance to test v0.9 of GSS against a real human opponent yet, due to not having enough friends.

And I should mention that I basically can't take on a level 9 Dark Lord Ganon, because his Forward Aerial KOs at about 80%, his Up Aerial KOs at about 95%, his Up Smash KOs at 75%, Forward Smash (normal mode) KOs at 70%, Up Special (normal mode)'s little darkness upper at the tip KOs at 55%, Down Special (normal mode) KOs at 95%, Down Smash (sword mode) KOs at 90%, Down Smash (normal mode) KOs at 75%, Neutral Special (normal mode) KOs at 35% and throws out a partly charged Super Scope shot that KOs at 115%, Back Aerial KOs at 120%, Down Aerial KOs at 85% if GSS is on the ground, etc. At around 75%, I have to play super defensively because most of his moves can KO me if I'm in a bad location when they hit.

[Akeno/Archer]

Competitive feedback? Well, I can say that GSS's playstyle encourages constant attacking, at least when using her machine gun. If you stop, you'll get whacked. If you miss, you'll get whacked. Fortunately, hitting isn't that hard. When playing GSS, I have the highest hit percentage of any character I play as, frequently around 65-75%. (Most characters I get less than 50%, sometimes as low as 30%.)

My personal favourite chain with GSS when using her Machine Gun is: Up Tilt > Down Aerial > Down Smash > Forward Smash > Neutral Special. Unfortunately, with its shortish range Neutral Special adds only 2 or 3% damage when used at the end like that.

And of course, I realise that that chain is very escapable in multiple places, especially by characters with good jump height and smallish hurtboxes. (AKA not KJP's Dark Lord Ganon, who is my primary target with GSS.) However, the CPU opponent frequently tries to jump out of Down Smash > Forward Smash, only for the edge of Forward Smash to drag him back in. I haven't had a chance to test v0.9 of GSS against a real human opponent yet, due to not having enough friends.

And I should mention that I basically can't take on a level 9 Dark Lord Ganon, because his Forward Aerial KOs at about 80%, his Up Aerial KOs at about 95%, his Up Smash KOs at 75%, Forward Smash (normal mode) KOs at 70%, Up Special (normal mode)'s little darkness upper at the tip KOs at 55%, Down Special (normal mode) KOs at 95%, Down Smash (sword mode) KOs at 90%, Down Smash (normal mode) KOs at 75%, Neutral Special (normal mode) KOs at 35% and throws out a partly charged Super Scope shot that KOs at 115%, Back Aerial KOs at 120%, Down Aerial KOs at 85% if GSS is on the ground, etc. At around 75%, I have to play super defensively because most of his moves can KO me if I'm in a bad location when they hit.

I see that you like to play agains Dark Lord Ganon... Try against a character like Cancellation Fox made by Kienamaru, you'll see that the range of the NB isn't really useful since that you cannot play safe...

[JamietheAuraUser]

Oh yeah, regarding my preferred attack chain, I find it sometimes useful to swap the locations of Down Smash and Forward Smash, for example if the opponent is still in the air because of Down Aerial connecting fully, they'll escape if I try to Down Smash, but Forward Smash's wide vertical reach will pull them in. Of course, that makes it so only the second part of Down Smash connects, but oh well.

And yeah, she really does have difficulty playing it safe, so your best bet is really just to throw up a wall of constant hitboxes everywhere. Hence what I said, "constant attacking. If you stop, you'll get whacked". Her other problem with playing it safe, aside from machine gun mode's Neutral Special having bad range, is that her rolling dodges suck. A lot.

That said, I personally rather like handgun mode's Up Special for evasion, as well. Decent KB and intangibility at the beginning. Handgun mode's grounded Side Special is pretty good, too. Has a lot of KB perfectly horizontally.It's really good when your foe's pushed you all the way to the edge of a walk-off stage, then when they go to attack again, SideB lets you dodge right past them and hit them from behind with enough knockback for a KO.

[zutox]

I too agree that she is a constant attacker and is vulnerable if caught of guard.
However, I think that suits her very well and that makes for intense matches, it's very fun having her with use when me and my friends brawl it out for sure. Sometimes I completely own all of them..but then in the second match they would manage to juggle me XD 
one of her greatest weaknesses in my mind is her down air. I think the range should be about that of neutral B, only aimed downwards to make use of her constant attacks. This is where I usually got caught of guard because the range is so terrible I would miss most of the time with that move and then once my opponents got going I couldn't really escape the barrage of attacks aimed at me. GSS is a light and quick character with pretty good range and a very intense playstyle, but her down air really could need some more range.

Also her side special in air, the one where you will "catch" an opponent and then spin around to shoot at them, but then go into free fall afterwards. I feel it should be slightly easier to hit with, or not have free fall, as it's pretty hard to hit with and a player would usually not use that since the gain isn't really worth it if he misses and gets into free fall, making her so very vulnerable

[ABloodyCanadian]

To be quite honest with you guys, I didn't really know what GSS's playstyle would be when I made the PSA. I simply had Resonance of Fate in mind, and incorporated some of that to the moveset. Even the gun changing system. But then I recently came up with something that may change up the PSA a bit. I recently have this idea of her playstyle being something along the lines of "Keep Moving, or you're screwed." The thing that made me realize that is the fact that in Resonance of Fate, you're invincible while using the Hero Gauge, or performing a Tri-Attack. They kept moving until they reach a certain point, and won't get attacked until after the attack finishes.

Well, that's my idea.

[JamietheAuraUser]

She already plays like that. Personally, I find that yeah, Down Aerial is a little short on range, though it's better than it was in the beta. Fortunately, Up Tilt has a lot more horizontal range than it looks like it does, so if you can get in close enough for that, you're good to go.

As I mentioned before, Up Tilt links very well into either Neutral Aerial (at higher percents) or Down Aerial (at lower percents), and Down Aerial has just enough hitstun and floats the enemy just enough to link very well into Forward Smash (don't fast-fall during the attack, instead fast-fall as soon as the last hitbox ends. Actually, fast-falling is almost completely unnecessary, but if you do it you can catch the enemy in Forward Smash earlier), since Forward Smash has a lot of vertical range and will pull the foe down right into it. And Down Smash very helpfully moves her forward midway through, so the second part chains fairly nicely out of Forward Smash, which has a little bit of KB at the end. And hitting the foe with Forward Smash out of Down Aerial leaves the foe in the air for the entire move, meaning if they already used their double jump to try (and fail) to escape from Down Aerial > Forward Smash, they cannot escape from Forward Smash > Down Smash unless they are a seriously fast-falling character.

In fact, now that I remember, if you catch the foe early enough with Forward Smash, the last hit will pull them straight into the first part of Down Smash, at which point Neutral Special afterwards is inescapable, though it still only deals a pathetic 3%. So the moral here is that yeah, Neutral Special needs more range.

Another chain that actually works fairly well if you have the timing to pull it off: Up Tilt > Neutral Aerial (start this move early in the jump so you use it while still ascending) > midair jump > Forward Aerial (wait until you're almost at the peak of the second jump). I think from there it would actually be possible to follow up with Side Special and then either Neutral, Up, or Forward Aerial, but I can't get the timing down on the first chain for that to work.

[ABloodyCanadian]

I'd like to get video footage of that... lol.

[JamietheAuraUser]

What? Up Tilt > Down Aerial > Forward Smash > Down Smash > Neutral Special?

I'd gladly oblige, but unfortunately I don't have a capture card.

Of course, that second chain I mentioned (Up Tilt > Neutral Aerial > midair jump > Forward Aerial) is actually VERY escapable, possibly even if executed with frame-perfect precision, because Neutral Aerial > midair jump > Forward Aerial leaves the foe plenty of time to air dodge, and because it depends on the foe's DI. The problem is that Neutral Aerial has just enough KB that if they DI horizontally, Side Special doesn't get you enough range.

Also, you know what move I think could stand to have a wider hitbox? Forward Aerial in machine gun mode. Actually, the handgun version of Forward Aerial needs some adjustment (in terms of either KB strength/direction or hitbox size/shape) as well, as the last hit often misses. I daresay the last hit could use more KB growth, too. I keep finding myself wishing I had a forward-firing aerial kill move. Machine gun back aerial has issues too, since it's hard to get the whole move to connect, and wasted hits are a very bad things as GSS.

[ABloodyCanadian]

The Machinegun Back Air is something I'm considering having a new animation. And I have no problems with the current Forward Air, but I can adjust a few things for the Handgun version. I can miss with that move also.

[JamietheAuraUser]

You know something else I think GSS would really benefit from? Slightly less ground traction. I keep wanting to do sliding Up Smashes to start combos, but they don't really work because she doesn't slide enough, which also makes them look slightly... off. Also, machine gun mode's Up Smash could stand to be cancellable into a jump right before she turns around. I'm thinking dash > Up Smash > Forward Aerial would be a really nice combo. Well, not actually a true combo, but you get my meaning.

[ABloodyCanadian]

I'm not gonna abuse Interrupt Events. Like I said, I want her to have a constant movement playstyle. Having Interrupt Events so she can do combos is something I don't plan on doing. That's what Blade Prince Marth is for... when I get on working on that...