Kage's Inner Sanctum: Using a Phoenix Down

[Total Voters: 34]

Forward ThrowBack ThrowDown ThrowUp Throw

[Kagemaru]

I'm fairly certain I put a read-me in the beta package that said the specials were not done...

I actually wasn't counting on getting any feedback from them cause they are still being worked on -_-


Freezing Problem with different outfits: I don't know why that happens... But I'm fairly certain its due to the size of the Moveset. Which is somewhat of a bad thing. I actually had that problem when playing with the other Wolverine outfits... so I had to put only the original Wolverine outfit on. This is only speculation... but if thats the issue, then there isn't much I can do about it since the moveset requires x amount of coding and the animations do as well.

Response to KiDTeeCT's Feedback:

AAA: Slash Slash Slash
Kinda of spammable since you can hold a to do the full combo and has no type of end lag to make it not spammable. This racks up damage pretty fast so i think it should have least damage and more end lag to be fair. Well the damage is set to 3%. end lag wise, I'll see about that. Its a valid point because he moves forward unlike most character's jab attacks.

Attack100: Swiss Cheese
It's pretty nothing bad about it

Forward Tilt: Cross slash
This is okay has effect which is kinda good for getting damage real fast but at the same time cheap because of how fast it comes out. I think this move should have little more start up lag but 7% damage to make up for start up lag. The effect is specifically to freeze opponent for 3 frames. I intend to take this effect off and add more knockback. I just don't know how to alter flags atm. So until I do, I'll prolly get Animaine to do it.

Up Tilt: Jump Slash
He should do more damage like 6%. He shouldn't move with it either just stay in one place. Sorry but nope. He's made to move and do low damage. If thats all thats wrong with it, then its fine as is.

Down Tilt: Double Slash
Nothing really bad about this.

Forward Smash: Side Swipe The tip of the smash has amazing kickback (like to good) and it's really spammable. Add some start up lag. Up close does 7% and Mid range 21% weird? The sweetspot knock back, I'm going to have to look at. Because I stated that it actually happened on accident. So I'm going to have to go in and analyze which hit box it is so that I can alter it to be a bit more balanced. Also, It seemed to have a decent enough start up to me... I play test it on Brawl- and computers dodge it all the time. I actually have to use it in combo's most of the time to make it land, or catch a computer with their guard down. The reason why it does less damage up close is because its not the claws tht hitting you. I'll look into the middle hit boxes though.

Up Smash: Tripple Stab
Pretty Balance. Should be able to hit in front of him a bit. I agree... I was just to lazy to change the animation to make it do so.

Down Smash: Foot Stab
Way too good!! Need alot of start up lag and end lag. Spammable so hard opponets can't really do anything to stop. And 50% at max! tone it down to like 30%. Racks up damage like crazy and get your opponets to 150% in 5 seconds. I'll probably add more end lag. I know its a bit fast.

Dash Attack: Drill Claw
It should make the foe move forwards not backwards. Thats a knockback problem. Which really isn't a problem at all. Its not knocking them back, its just that he is drilling through them. I'll see if I like it after changing the knockback to move them forward (its currently set to 0 atm)

Aerials: Nonething wrong with them just can't really hit up air alot. Up has poor range for some reason. I've tried fixing it, but I'll try again


B attacks: not really helpful or useuable i think you know this already Yeah... I knew Its in the Read-Me

-Drops way to fast can't really do a meteor smash with him I actually have a fairly easy time landing this... and recovering.

-Not a bad character just needs to be less spammable

-Grabs are amazing tone them down just a bit I'm assuming you mean the forward and down grab since I didn't change the other two. The down grab needs work. The throwing collision is messed up. Previously, it was supposed to knock you at a 45 degree angle downward/behind Wolverine, but as you can see its not doing that. So it'll get fixed. Forward grab will be sped up since I believe I gave you guys the version with the slow stabs.

Its 11:49pm here, I just got home, and I wanna play RE: ORC before I go to sleep. I'll rspond to the other feedback some time tomorrow. Thanks KiDTeeCT for betaing. You've been helpful. Not to say the others haven't, I just haven't gotten to them yet.

Night

PS: Why is my Avi what it is :/ I've been gone all weekend...

[Naruto200Man]

Kagemaru: I got some moar sexy rock lee update screens for you =3

Others: It's already uploaded to my vault if you want the non-psa version *sideglance*

I can probably get the smashes and ground A's done tomorrow, I might need some help with specials *nod*

[Kagemaru]

Through my brief experience with PSA, I can say that at least the Side-B move shouldn't be that difficult to code. Nor should the Down B.

Up may be a bit difficult...

Also, you should start coding the opened gates stuff now. Since the animations are done. Going back and coding it later is a pain in the rear since all it is is re-coding the same moves with "if" statements.

[Naruto200Man]

Yeah I think the up B on the ground would be closer to marths up special than anyone elses, except he doesn't travel quite as high into the air, and the hitboxes/graphics are different. In the air it'd be no different than a juiced up Normal Air attack *nod*

As for the gate opening, I think I can do that, would you want me to show those in the video?

[Kagemaru]

The height and gfx is not a problem actually.

The coding issue would come with making the game recognize him as moving. At least thats what was hard for me when I was coding Wolverine's up-B. I actually had a different Up-B then what I have now, but I couldn't make it work, so I had to split the one animation I had into the separate parts to accommodate Wolf's numerous up-b move animations.

[Naruto200Man]

Did you try opening the animation flags for the up B subactions and clicking 'moves character' ?
I think there's some paremeters that control momentum and direction, luckilly link only has one up B animation/subaction and KJP says we can just remove the old stuff for his specials and have it be 100% subaction related.

For the Side B I'd look at DK's up B, it kind of floats and moves like the leaf Hurricane Does.

[Kagemaru]

That works too. As long as you know how to do it... thats cool. I'm just doing the animations xD

Today I plan to get Sanji's Down Special(ground) finished, Sasuke's AAA combo, and adjust some of Wolverine's animations.
Post Merge: April 02, 2012, 11:31:28 PM

Wolverine
AAA: Overall fine, needs smother transitions though. I don't really know how much more smoother of a transition it can get... I copied one frame from attack11 and made it the starting frame for attack12, and copied a frame from attack12, and made it the starting frame for the Attack100 start...

A 100: Its good, I like the attack but the animation can use some work. Agreed, but unfortunately, brawl lacks the gfx that MvC has, so I can't exactly make his fists copy multiple times like they do in that game. I'll smooth it out as best I can though.

Side Tilt: Good, but feels like something is missing with in those few seconds the opponent is in shock. Maybe add a second hit, or have Wolverine be able to attack while the character is in shock. I actually got this suggestion a little while ago. So I'll probably implement it.

Up Tilt: All is good, its my favorite tilt, and for a odd reason one of my favorite attacks, lol.
Down Tilt: Good damage, but animation can use a touch. and defiantly needs more knock back, even at 999% the opponent did not fly of the screen. Noted
Special: Needs lag, at the moment its able to build damage so fast and is spamable. II would use special, A, Special, A and so on and so forth and I would have the enemy killed in no time. The attack leaves the CP defenseless, so adding some type of lag will help balance it out. Well considering its not functioning correctly... I didn't see to make it have lag just yet. I was more concerned with making it work first...

Side Special: I don't like the attack, it does little damage, animations look odd, and there is no knock back. Also whats the point of Wolverine stopping at the end of the attack? I think you tried to have the side special be a way of recovering, but it really is not that useful. Again... like I put in the Read-Me, the specials aren't operational fully... That sudden stop... then move forward is a result of Wolf's side b coding which has yet to be fixed. I put it in the read me that they weren't compete... I dunno why you guys bothered giving me feed back on them. -_-
Down Special: Freezes, but you told us that ahead of time.
Up Special: Its needs a little work. I had main Wolf so when I saw the Up B had been nearly the same I thought it would be no problem to use but the attack is odd. Recovery is great, but it comes out odd. When ever I try to use it to the side I all ways activate the side special, its kinda frustrating. It would not hurt to add what Wolf had to make using the Up special diagonally possible. Its possible. But wolf had a longer start up time, so you could aim better. Wolf had like... 20+ or so frames for his UpSpecial Start animation... Wolverine has like 8. Again, its not done, the animations I'm using currently are place holders until the coding can get fixed. Originally, he wasn't even supposed to go in any direction. He was supposed to move similar to Marth's Up-B but I couldn't get the coding to work.

Side A: Love the attack, especially since it has a sweet spot. The sweet spot was accidental. But I'm going to keep it... I have to tweak it some though to make it fair.

Down A: I also love this attack for the sweet spot. Slight mistake on my part, I have forgotten a few times to tone the damage down. Currently its using the damage from Wolf's original Down Smash which if you have played or fought him, would know that he hits from one side to the other. So each slash is supposed to do the same damage but only hit once. Wolverine's animation makes him hit you twice. Which is why its so powerful atm. I plan to fix that.

Up A: solid attack, good damage, and knock back. Just needs some animation work. I'm getting mixed messages here. Some are saying it looks great, some are saying its bad. I personally like it, I just need to make it have a bit more forward/back range.

N Air: Like the attack, but I suggest you shorten it up a bit, it does a lot of damage at the moment. And add some knock back. It does 15 damage... max (if all hits connect). Is that not low?
Side Air: Good and simple.
Back Air: Is there one? Yeah -_-

Down Air: Love it, its useful and it spikes.
Air Up: Isn't this Wolf's? Either way it works. No, its not wolf's.


Extras
Animations: For the most part the animations were really good. This is your first project right? Either way these animations are very nice. Every time I said the aniamtions need some work, looking back on it now, I think the issue is that the animations go by to fast. Which sucks to see you work so hard on a animation only to have it be sped up so much. So maybe try slowing down a few attacks, you don't want your hard work to be hidden man. Well he's supposed to be fast, but I'll see about slowing down some of his attacks.

Physics: He is defiantly a odd one, fast speed and yet he is so heavy in air. I think he should be a little better in air, although his recoveries are really good, there were many times I miss the edge by such a small difference. Maybe the second jump can be slightly better? I'm fairly certain I made his weight in the air similar to Fox's... But he is meant to be heavy. Dude has a metal plated skeleton... I want to convey the feeling of weight. Not as much as Bowser or Ganon do, but something a bit like Ike's but faster.

Models: The psa is very picky. It won't load any thing that is high in file size I am guessing. I attempted to use Nanos Metal Sonic, or Beyonds Vegeta and both froze the game. However, other models like Stars Skull kid, and Wolf's brawl model work fine. I do not know if this is fixable or not but would be nice. It kinda bugs me when psa's can only be used by models  supplied by the creator. Makes you miss all the other nice rigs or vertex that go over the character. I'm pretty sure this means I'm approching the file size limit on the PSA. Which is bad... I'll see what I can do. Hopefully, the new BrawlBox comes out soon and it should be able to decrease code to fit filesize... or increase filesize... or whatever its supposed to do... it'll help.

So your off on a good start. But he can still use some touches, I look forward to see how you can fix these issues, or see what replacments you may make. And thanks for letting me test it out man.

Thanks for the feedback, but what no one is giving me is how he stacks up generally to other characters. How hard of a time did you have in matches? Did it feel natural or like what Wolverine would do?


Also, I'm working on getting MvC3 some time soon, so if Wolverine isn't released by the time I get it, expect a slight overhaul in animations to make it based off the game a bit more. (meaning SDoom gets his Dive Kick)



Also, if everyone interested would post their opinion on if I should release the beta to the public or not, please do. Because I'm pretty sure it wont be out by wednesday. *Needs to speak with ShadowMarth*

[Master Penis]

When I was playing against my friend, we pit him against many movesets (SMBZ Marios, Goku over Pit, Shadow, Kid Buu just to name a few), and I found it pretty hard to compete in matches vs. my friend. We also pit him against some regular characters too. He felt a little awkward when I tried to play as him. It didn't really feel to natural, but it was workable. Sorry if this is useless feedback...

[Kagemaru]

Hm... I'll ponder on that.

[Kagemaru]

As the Op said... I'm taking a break from Wolverine momentarily in order to focus on other projects.

Namely Sanji and Sasuke.

Because these projects, I'm mainly an animator, and thus, I can get more work done in afaster amount of time then if I had to PSA it as well.

As far as Wolverine goes, I'm mulling over releasing whats been done as a Beta. But for now, I'm going to focus mainly on helping with animating Sanji and Sasuke (Hebi).

The info on them can be seen in their respective threads. Animaine has the info in his threads.

[Carnage]

kagemaru i know you are full of projects right now but when you finish them would you be interesting in working on a war machine psa over CF?

[Kagemaru]

Sure. WainoIronMan?

[Solar99]

You're the one who gave me Wolverine's model and animations a few weeks ago, right?

[Kagemaru]

Possibly.... can't say i remember why though. Can you PSA?

[Carnage]

Sure. WainoIronMan?

dont know i like war machine better xD since he can fire missiles ,machine gun and etc while iron man is all beam based