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Author Topic: Project M KC-MM Discussion Thread: Demo 2.5 Announcement  (Read 20375 times)
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SiLeNtDo0m
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    « on: August 10, 2011, 09:44:56 AM »


    To read my little rant from about a year ago regarding P:M, open this spoiler.  Otherwise, just read on:  

    Okay so as quite a few of you know I fairly recently got accepted into the Project M team, and I've been making animations for them.  Because of this, I've been able to properly learn more about Project M, and have been able to play the closed alpha (the current release build for the ordinary peepz to test is waaaaaay outdated compared to the current builds in the closed alpha).  Not only this, but I've been able to be a part of some of the discussion topics and back room chat.  

    The purpose of this thread is not to convince you guys to use Project M.  I know that no matter what I say, some of you will refuse to actually use it which is absolutely fine, since I know that P:M isn't for everyone.  This topic is more to enlighten people on what P:M actually is, since some of you have built off views on it based off almost nothing and as a result seem very misinformed.  So without further ado, let's begin the essay XD


    1)  Let me first start off by saying that I have always preferred Brawl to Melee.  This is for a number of reasons.  First is that Brawl is just more accessible, easier to get into and has more content and characters.  Whenever I wanted to play with friends, I always just found Brawl to be a more favourable choice.  It just seemed so much "grander" and inviting.  

    Furthermore, I've never really been a competitive player.  Sure, I love a bit of friendly competition between my mates, but I don't got to tournaments or anything.  However, I thoroughly enjoy playing P:M probably as much as I enjoy Brawl- (i.e. more than vBrawl and WAY more than Melee).  So don't think for a second that P:M can only be liked by Melee loving tourney players.


    2) The most common misconception about P:M is that it's just a Melee clone and as a result people just go "Why would I want to play a worse version of Melee?".  I'm just going to flat out say it.

    YOU ARE WRONG

    Project M's entire concept is for it to feel more like a sequel to Melee.  Whilst Brawl went in a completely different direction as far as its game engine goes, appealing more to a casual audience whilst still having a decent level of competitive gameplay, P:M follows a closer goal to Melee BUT NOT AN IDENTICAL ONE.  It's goal is to create a more technical and competitive fighting engine similar to Melee's (and as a result its physics engine is very similar), whilst still having the relative accessibility of Brawl.  Jumping into P:M is a lot easier than jumping into Melee in my opinion.  As well as this, it's trying to create a more balanced roster so that every character has a good fighting chance whilst giving each character a good level of depth to their playstyle.  EVERY character feels rewarding in some shape or form, which is something neither vBrawl nor Melee achieved very well.  


    3) Another common misconception is that the characters are all going to be made to play exactly like they did in Melee.  This again, isn't necessarily true.  The main characters that this holds true to are the Melee top tiers like Fox, and even they don't feel exactly the same.  This is because of the simple fact that "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".  Every character has been designed so that they fit into this faster paced, more competitive environment.  This is the main reason why they recloned Falco.  Whilst Brawl Falco does extremely will in Brawl's environment, he doesn't do well that well in Melee.

    However, the main thing that the P:M team is going for is balance.  They wouldn't replicate each character as they were in Melee, because it just wouldn't be balanced (since Melee isn't balanced and neither is Brawl).  They're doing certain things to each character to make them not only feel slightly different, but to make them overall feel more well rounded, balanced, rewarding and fun.  Here are a few examples:

    - Mario is not just his Melee incarnation.  There are quite a few aspects of him that are from Dr. Mario too.  Mario has always been either a Middle or Low Tier character, but infusing both the slightly increased speed of regular Mario, with the increased power of Dr. Mario makes him and overall more powerful jack-of-all-trades character.
    - Ganondorf has a mixture of moves from both Melee and Brawl.  Whilst the majority of his moveset is more like it was in Melee (since anyone with half a brain can tell you that Ganon was MUCH better in Melee than he is in Brawl), but some of the better aspects of his Brawl moveset were kept too.  He kept his Brawl tilts (except they're a tad faster now), his Brawl Neutral B and most importantly his Brawl Side B.
    - Bowser is now monstrous.  In both Melee and Brawl, he is undeniably quite a bad character and always stuck at Bottom Tier.  In P:M, he is a complete powerhouse.  He is the perfect representation now of what a heavyweight character should be in Smash.  Slow and powerful.  Though rather than giving more explanations, I think I'll just leave you with this video:

    #Invalid YouTube Link#  

    And don't even get me started on the treatment that some of the newcomers are getting (i.e. the characters that are only in Brawl).  If there was one reason that could sway someone into playing P:M, I'd have to just say Project M Lucario.  Either that, or Charizard's Seismic Toss U Throw.  But seriously, the amount of creativity and depth that shines from Lucario is amazing.  Here's a video with the most recent build of P:M Lucario in a video (it's constantly changing).  He's in the 2nd match which starts at 3:33 :

    #Invalid YouTube Link#


    4) Some people think that they are recreating even the Melee models and stuff blah blah blah.  If you think this, you are again wrong.  They aren't.  Simple as.  Project M is just a codeset with PSAs and stages.  No models are included except for a few recolours for team packs etc (i.e. for Sonic for example, it's a pure red Sonic with green shoes rather than having that reddish hue he has in Brawl).  The people doing Melee models (i.e. Gamewatching, KTH etc), aren't doing it for Project M.


    5) Which actually brings me onto probably my final point.  Characters are not the only things that are getting revamped.  Stages are as well.  They aren't necessarily taking all the stages in Melee and putting them into Brawl because to be honest half of Melee's stages suck for competitive play.  Some stages have been replaced completely with different ones (e.g. Luigi's Mansion is now Dracula's Castle, Green Greens is now Dreamland 64, Bridge of Eldin is now Hyrule Castle 64 etc) and others are getting edited to be more playable (Norfair now consists of one good sized platform with 3 smaller ones, rather than 5 baby sized platforms all spread out.  The most drastically changed is probably Temple.  See this video here):

    #Invalid YouTube Link#


    I'll just finish off by saying when it comes down to it, it's all about how much fun you can have.  This is main reason why I enjoy Brawl Minus as well.  However, this kind of genuine fun comes out of quite a few things.  The first being whether or not it feels rewarding or satisfying, the second being whether it's unique and the third being whether or not it has enough depth.  Project M, in my opinion, fills all three of these and with a higher level of professionalism than any other Brawl modset, and as a result it's fun to play.


    Now I'll say it again, I'm NOT forcing anyone to use or even get hyped about Project M.  When it comes down to it, I (or anyone else for that matter) cannot control your decisions.  You are all free people XD  I am merely enlightening people to what Project M actually is, rather than what people seem to think it is.  It isn't the "soulless Melee clone" that some of you are making it out to be.  

    Peace out ^^



    I've decided to turn this into a thread for all the latest Project:M updates and such.  For more information about the project and to download the current version, see this site here:  http://projectm.dantarion.com/

    Most Recent Update

    Quote
    9th October 2012

    We are pleased to announce Project M Demo 2.5, our next public release!

    You do not want to miss what we have hiding behind the curtains. Through constant refinement, and the completion of new content,  we are again prepared for another public release.

    We have a ton of balance updates, aesthetic surprises, and even a few new characters for you to soon enjoy! Stay tuned for more exciting announcements, character pages, and live-streams showcasing our progress with demo 2.5 in the upcoming weeks.

    Demo 2.5 Teaser Video

     

    Past Updates  
    « Last Edit: October 10, 2012, 12:05:43 PM by SiLeNtDo0m » Logged


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    « Reply #1 on: August 10, 2011, 10:21:11 AM »


    *claps*

    Finally a good definition about P:M :3

    I guess I'm gonna need to update my alpha, that lucario is way too different to the one I got the last time I updated xD

    Only one thing to say. If P:M is taking forever to be completed, is due to the deepness and soul SDoom has talked about. Balancing everything is really complex, and ideas are flowing every day. In my opinion, there's more creativity in P:M than in Nintendo, Sora, and every mark related to Brawl.
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    « Reply #2 on: August 10, 2011, 10:36:27 AM »


    I'm satisfied with the explanations.

    But something tells me that P:M will never be finished, at least not before the next Smash Bros comes out.
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    « Reply #3 on: August 10, 2011, 10:48:22 AM »


    Nicely said SDoom
    I really do love what they have done with Lucario, by making him have some street fighter and dragon ball esque moves thrown in.
    These people are quite creative and I cannot wait to see what else comes from P:M
    I really cannot wait to see how other newcomers are going to look. I really like the addition of down B moves for all the pokemon trainers pokemon it'll be intresting to see the moves added to the other pokemon.

    Also this is just a question but has there been a new site or something for project M?
    Because they havn't updated at all with characters like lucario or charizard...
    Or is it because there movesets are still not final?
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    « Reply #4 on: August 10, 2011, 10:55:20 AM »


    i know i will use Project: M as my main codeset then it is done (thats also why i will make many of my popalur movesets to that codeset like Melee Air dodges and etc.)
    i love many of the changes(DBZ/P:M Lucario Cheesy)+have the old moveset of mario back (his Down-B mainly)
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    « Reply #5 on: August 10, 2011, 10:59:26 AM »


    I'm satisfied with the explanations.

    But something tells me that P:M will never be finished, at least not before the next Smash Bros comes out.


    I'm not sure if you'll have to worry about that since Smash 4 doesn't really exist yet(Development will not start until Kid Icarus Uprising is done).

    They may pull a Pikmin 3 and have no progress or updates for 3 years. Seriously, what happened to that game? It was announced in 2008 but we haven't heard a thing about it since. Is it going to pull a Twilight Princess?

    Pikmin 3 DID pull a TP, but worse.
    http://wii.ign.com/articles/117/1173945p1.html

    It's not for the Wii.
    « Last Edit: August 10, 2011, 11:03:21 AM by Eternal Yoshi » Logged


    SiLeNtDo0m
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    « Reply #6 on: August 10, 2011, 11:09:23 AM »


    Nicely said SDoom
    I really do love what they have done with Lucario, by making him have some street fighter and dragon ball esque moves thrown in.
    These people are quite creative and I cannot wait to see what else comes from P:M
    I really cannot wait to see how other newcomers are going to look. I really like the addition of down B moves for all the pokemon trainers pokemon it'll be intresting to see the moves added to the other pokemon.

    Also this is just a question but has there been a new site or something for project M?
    Because they havn't updated at all with characters like lucario or charizard...
    Or is it because there movesets are still not final?

    The site hasn't changed, but neither has the demo.  That demo is very old.  I also have no idea when an updated release will be since almost nothing is finalised yet.  Even things that seem complete aren't actually finalised since this takes LOADS of fine tuning.
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    « Reply #7 on: August 10, 2011, 11:18:23 AM »


    The site hasn't changed, but neither has the demo.  That demo is very old.  I also have no idea when an updated release will be since almost nothing is finalised yet.  Even things that seem complete aren't actually finalised since this takes LOADS of fine tuning.

    Ah see I thought the site was there just to show progress in the project not just show what's in the demo releases.


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    « Reply #8 on: August 10, 2011, 11:18:34 AM »


    oh, that how you play project M?
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    « Reply #9 on: August 10, 2011, 12:06:50 PM »


    Well, thanks to you, I finally know what project M is xD. I'm building SSBBL to be a fast-paced, tense, competitve game, but I never thought about the people who just wanna have some casual fighting XD.
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    « Reply #10 on: August 10, 2011, 02:46:44 PM »


    I am very excited for P:M Wario Smiley
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    « Reply #11 on: August 10, 2011, 04:00:00 PM »


    Ok, you got me at the Bowser video, I've been an avid Brawl+ player for a long time but this is looking very promising now.
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    « Reply #12 on: August 10, 2011, 04:05:26 PM »


    meh...
    looking good, but still needs to get more melee-like before I'll play it Wink

    I've already got Melee Pichu planned
    the Pichu here sux ballz XDD *does not approve*

    I don't mean that as a put-down...
    I'm keeping my promise I made about putting Pichu in Brawl (:<
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    « Reply #13 on: August 10, 2011, 05:25:40 PM »


    If it becomes more Melee like then it'll take out its appeal.
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    « Reply #14 on: August 10, 2011, 05:31:23 PM »


    This looks good man, very good.

    I read some of it, but not all. I never judge before seeing, or trying it for myself. Too bad most people do that.

    Posting here to be reminded about it later.

    Imma prepare my "spliff" as you called it, and read all of this.

    Wink
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